debwill Posted December 16, 2009 Report Share Posted December 16, 2009 Chase, You're correct. The no rebuilding is for THR Thunder Stocks, Super Stocks and TSRS Late Models only. As you stated, we're using the same Truck rules as HMP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supertx Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 Crate motors what a great idea we all see what it did to the super late models in the state. I THINK IM GOING TO PUKE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer61 Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 There are a lot more open motors busted for cheating than there are crates or sealed. ...... That's because most tracks with crates don't tech them. How can you catch a cheater if you don't tech? As has been clearly noted on here, just because there are seal bolts on the engine doesn't mean it hasn't been cheated. That my friend is the whole issue. Plain and simple! Crates cannot be above being teched as they are treated right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hray Posted December 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 It would be real easy to pump them, check compression, inspect rockers and lifters and measure cam lift. Under ASA rules you are allowed to replace the pan with a shallower pan for cross member clearance without putting a seal back on the pan. You could require all crates to have an inspection plug welded in the pan. With these very simple checks you could catch the majority of cheater crates. If there's an obvious power difference between one competitor and the rest, and nothing is detected with the above tests, dyno the engine. These engines have a very narrow range of HP, so anything out of that range is probably cheated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waddy Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 any steel head, max cu in,s, max comp, 4412, 8 inch tires (hard) oil pan hole , tech 2 people 10 mins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest THRRD Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 What don't most of you understand? THR officials at the meeting, stated very clear, or at least tried to, that the crate was a opption. You don't like the idea of an affordable option, don't run it. this is why it is an option....... Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maverick Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 hray, here is an idea. Why dont you go race somewhere, finish on the lead lap and put up some protest money to see if someone is cheating. Otherwise, most people understand that the backmarkers are notorious for claiming the front runnners are cheaters. By the way, what track or series are you suggesting that does not tech the motors? I sure hear a lot about motors being pulled, chassis dynos brought it, people DQ'd for tampering with the crate motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hray Posted December 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 Cory, Ditto! Terry, I don't know if you were referring to my comments with your remark, but I do understand that the crate is an option- and a good one for those that already have a crate or think they are less expensive. My remarks are meant to contrast the differences in how a crate is tech'ed verses a built motor. There's a vast difference. Ask Jack for his list of things he tech'ed on built motors last year and then for the same for the crate motors he tech'ed. My point is: someone shows up with a crate, they get the same treatment as those with built motors with consideration for the fact that you can't unseal the motor (with the exception of the oil pan). My preference is to open up the motor rules as much as possible, but tech them all. Maverick, Why don't you We run a crate motor and it's never been tech'ed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGural Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 JMO..It's a shame changing the tire and tire rules for TSRS wasn't an option. Could make the whole engine thing a non-issue...building ultra high $$$ or cheated-up engines would be less of an advantage. Still confused why the crate deal is setup the way it is. Just seems like a conflict of interest where funny business or mis-understandings could develop. Haven't seen sealed engines work to limit spending or cheating. Maybe should just take the seals off, allow freshens, and make them subject to teardowns, just like the open engines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProTree Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 TG,that's the way we do our crate motor stock classes in my sport,no builder seals.come thru tech before the race(every race event),pass, and we'll seal what you're not removing.if you have to remove a part for some reason (intake,head,carb,etc)come see us and we'll either approve or disapprove it.if something is approved,and removed for replacement,adjustment,or repair,it's resealed before racing.if anytime during/after event we check and a seal is broken or tampered with,DQ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modracer Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 How can an official with the series sell motors to those who are in the series? Sounds like a conflict of interest and to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KISS_Racing Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 Mod, just curious as to why you think so? I am not arguing pro or con. I am just curious... Thanks, Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Moon Motorsports Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 No different than the track selling the tires or fuel...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest THRRD Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 HMP has been selling crates,carbs,etc. for years, nobody complained. Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debwill Posted December 17, 2009 Report Share Posted December 17, 2009 The discussions among the THR management team about possibly adding crate engines began long before Terry rejoined the staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RxGraphite Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 I think too often we forget about all the work THR's staff accomplishes. They certainly aren't in it for the money. We are quite fortunate to have Mr. Barden selling the crate engines at 10% over cost. Go price them on line. $3,200 is a steal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Moon Motorsports Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 I think too often we forget about all the work THR's staff accomplishes. They certainly aren't in it for the money. We are quite fortunate to have Mr. Barden selling the crate engines at 10% over cost. Go price them on line. $3,200 is a steal. $3750 from the GM Dealer. Like Terry's price ALOT better! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xcellracing Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 $3200 is less than 10% over cost. They are crate motors!!! how can there be a conflict. Good to have you back Terry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RxGraphite Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 At the THR drivers meeting on Dec 12, it was announced and listed in Nick's live blog as below 2:58 A topic open for discussion ... Option for 602 crates in Thunder and Super Stocks.. Lots of eyebrows raised. Track Claim rule will be instituted.. $3,200 claim will be instituted. Track can buy any crate for $3,200 so don't go get em "done." Emphasized that it is an OPTION, not required.. Saturday December 12, 2009 2:58 Mr. Barden quoted a price on the 602 crate engine this morning of $3350 - $300 rebate = $3050 good until Dec. 31, 2009 The price on crate engines could change month to month. Also, GM has changed part numbers on this item recently. I hope this helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gundogC3 Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 602.......2,800 at HMP till the end of the month...hell of a deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KISS_Racing Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Terry, Thanks for the opportunity to save some money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProTree Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 i'd jump on it,www.gmperfpartsrebate.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted December 18, 2009 Report Share Posted December 18, 2009 Here is the release from GM Performance Parts +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ GM PERFORMANCE PARTS OFFERS REBATE FOR ENGINE BUYERS GRAND BLANC, Mich. (Dec. 18) - GM Performance Parts recently announced a special rebate program to help circle tracks racers preparing for the 2010 season. As an incentive for current or new users of GMPP sealed circle track crate engines, GM Performance Parts will rebate money directly to the racer for engines purchased between December 1-31, 2009. The rebate schedule is: GMPP Part # Application Rebate Amount 88958602 CT350 $300 (19258602) CT350 $300 88958603 CT355 $400 88958604 CT400 $500 This special never-before-and-likely-never-again offer applies only to the GMPP Circle Track crate engines listed above, purchased from a GM Performance Parts dealer or authorized retail outlet. To get your “racing stimulus rebate” go to www.gmperfpartsrebate.com All you have to do is: • Download the “Racing Rebate from GM Performance Parts” rebate form. • Fill out your registration information. • Supply original invoice or receipt to verify proof-of-purchase. • Mail in the requested information before January 31, 2010. Your “racing rebate” will be mailed directly to the address you supply! We sincerely thank all of our GM Performance Parts customers for their past and future support! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Ann Naumann Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Crate motors what a great idea we all see what it did to the super late models in the state. I THINK IM GOING TO PUKE I heard you were feeling bad Joe, didn't realize it was due to this thread! Maybe you will like the next one, better! It was a hard call and it too will not please everyone. http://www.lonestarspeedzone.com/forums/in...showtopic=32735[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supertx Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Hello Mary Ann Thank you ,Thank you, I do feel better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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