Houston Latemodels Sanctioned by ASA

[Colt15]

You’re absolutely right, SLM’s are expensive, but I believe if you asked most people who have raced SLM’s or want to race SLM’s the number one reason for them not racing is COST.

10-4 on that

[Whitey741]

I have seen a fleet of crate motor cars racing.

It is like sitting in the local pub watching the train go around and around or racing at Malibu Grand Prix.

That is some boring stuff man

 

Where is this fleet of crate cars?

HMP is the only crate class around here that I know of. They have been trying for 3 years and the count is finally beginning to build. Some follow the leader and some pretty good racing too. As the car count builds I beleive the racing will get better. The racing has definitely tightened. At the beginning of the year we had 11 or 12. That decreased as some were wrecked and so on.

[Guest lidllarry]

Everyone want to race cup too but the #1 reason they do not is cost.

That is why there is different divisions.

You can race most places somewhere on any budget.

It all starts at the enty level, like Allisons, then trucks, Late Models etc.

The more you get started early the more you will have that move up a division.

Some wait too late and dont want to race because they are not competitve at a level which most people their age are racing.

So get em started young, go karts, legends and keep breeding racers.

 

Whitey, I watched them at Madison Internatinal.

[Whitey741]

How long had they been racing the crate motors. Which motor & how many cars ? Was it growing or stagnant?

I am just curious, not trying to instigate anything.

TIm

[Guest lidllarry]

Whitey,

It was the ASA Late Model Touring series so I guess it was the big crates? If I remember correctly, the SLM were running 17.5's on the 1/2 mile track and the ASA cars were about 1/2 second behind that. The SLM did stretch the field and ran a lot of green flag laps. There were good handling cars and even bad handling cars that were fast enough to stay out of trouble. The problem with the ASA cars were that they were all equal and when one car started having handling problems, it usually took out a few cars with it because they were bumper to bumper. The ASA guys had lots of fights or near fights. To me, equal racing is boring, I like to see races up front, in the middle and the back. That is what you had in the SLM up there, several races going on. The ASA cars were like they were hooked together. Maybe a different track would have been better, I dont know, but the SLM did put on one of the best local shows I have ever witnessed and there were about 16 of them and I think 28 or 30 ASA cars that started. I did not get there for qualifying but I think there were a few that did not make the show in ASA.

[lendo38]

I still think that leaving the SLM series alone and standardizing all other LM series so that they could all run together is the best deal. Maybe let the 400 hp crate run in either SLM or LM venues with either brakes or limitations. I think this will help car counts all over and let people travel to other tracks.

[arts22]

The Snowflake is a 400hp crate motor race.... I'm sure we'll find out if it was a race or follow the leader....

[Whitey741]

It was the ASA Late Model Touring series so I guess it was the big crates?

 

If it was the ASA late model it would be the 400HP

 

Someone may have to correct me here but it would depend on how long ago that was.

The original ASA touring series was a 350 chevy but with some type of computer motor control ( fuel injection?) and some chassis differences.

Someone here will know.

The ASA label is about the only thing that remains of that old series.

 

My mind may be rusty so lets see.

[legacy47]

Did ASA (national tour) run the LS1 motor ? seems like I saw that somewhere.

[Guest lidllarry]

The race I was refering to was run this year.

 

CommonSenceRacer.......I have done some checking on prices of Super Late Model equipment, and I think you are way off on what it cost to run. I have inquired about 3 cars. Two have won races recently and are available as complete cars for arouind $20,000 to $22,000. One was all brand new and he has not decided what he wants for it complete yet. I think there is also a concept motor for sale by someone on here for around $8500 that has set a track record. So I dont know who is blowing smoke or trying to sell you something, but it is way off.

Besides, the Super Late Model class is supposed to be as close to a Run What You Brung, Outlaw Cheater, no holes barred racing series that fans love to watch. It does not matter if there are 15 or 30 of them, if they can afford it and have the skills, the fans deserve to have the opportunity to watch a High Strung Series. I think that it is nice to go to the track and see big rigs, teams with multiple cars, motorhomes, toterhomes and things like that. You feel like you are getting your moneys worth watching first class people who have worked hard to get where they are in racing.

[KC11]

I have been watching the post and just have to chime in. I agree with there being a place for super lates and I think there is enough cars to support a cheaper good solid rule based crate class. It would sure be hard to do in Texas with all the different classes out there but it sure would be neat to have a car you could run all over the country (ASALM).

 

I have raced in 3 ASALM races and it was a blast. Good competition and very good car count. Yes the cars were more equal than Supers but I think it made for real good racing. There was a lot of travel time which made it tough to do.

 

To set the record straight about the cost of Superlate models. I have owned a ASALM (about $35000+ new) and now own a superlate. I'm not going to speak for others but I have at least $20,000 in my motor (concept because its cheaper) and about $30,000 + in the car. Yes you can pick up a used car for a reasonable price but don't let the the price of a few use cars let you think that SuperLateModels are affordable. There are plenty of cars racing in the USRA that cost over $60,000. Call Hamner Race Engines and ask the price of a 9 to 1 motor or a concept. Then add in a Jerico Trans, 5.5" clutch, Brakeman Brakes, Locker Rear ends, dry sump pumps and tanks, double adjustible shocks, al. drive shafts, dual msd, ect. Don't forget a set of tires everytime you go to the track. Kinda silly but I find myself right in the middle of it.

 

I will be racing the full schedual of USRA Superlates in 2006 and support Terry D. and Wayne all the way in trying to make SuperLates in Texas a great success. I am also going to try some ASALM shows in the South.

 

I think it would be awesome to have a Texas based ASA Latemodel Series and wish them the best in doing so.

Kirby Caldwell #67 God Speed

[CommonSenseRacing]

Okay Larry,

 

First, a brand new Port City car is around $22,000 with all the bells and whistles. I used to race SLMs about fifteen years ago in another region and back then my motor was over $12,000. I was speaking with a friend who still runs the division and his new motor cost

$22,500. Yes, you can buy a used car for about $22,000, with a season on a motor that will need to be freshened up at cost of about $4,500.

 

Second, I never wanted to eliminate SLMs, I was proposing an idea that could promote growth in the sport. For example, the last HMP race that the SLMs ran the TSRS cars were also there, together there were 33 – 36 cars. Let’s just say for argument sake, TSRS rules and the local LM rules were the same. Guys who want to travel could run the TSRS and guys who want to stay local could run their home track. When the TSRS ran a race at their local track they could combine the field and have a much better race. Then we could leave the SLMs alone, but I believe a lot of SLMs would convert.

 

Finally, when it comes to boring races, it’s not the motor that makes it boring it’s starting the fastest guy on the pole that makes the races boring. Boring is also having four cars on the lead lap at the end of a race.

[supertx]

There is a great article in the PRI mag. in Sept.For the ones that don't no what PRI Is it stands for performace racing industry, it is the trade jouranl for people involved in the bussiness side this was a very unbias article about the good and the bad of crate engines.It is worth reading but quite frankly I know that T.D. don't really cares what anybody thinks and he is going to do what he thinks he has got to do to help his bussiness. What i see happening with crate engines is a $7500 engine that will end up costing aleast 10 to 12000 or more buy the time you end up.I know for a fact that some people that already run crate engines have them gone thru by there engine builders this was talked about in the article above and i know of some people in TX that has there motors tricked out.It will be like anything else in racing the people that have money will find a way to get to the frront.If you think that spending 7500 min. on a crate engine that will have know resell value is a good deal go for it.

[arts22]

Supertx, the 400hp crate motor is $5450. If the series has there own seals for the motor then it would be hard to mess with.. I had a crate motor in my truck. When I first got it I had the timing chain replaced as everyone does and it is resealed with ARTS stamped seals and numbered.........

[Guest lidllarry]

CommonSenseRacing

I must have misunderstood your quote....................................

" The USRA cars could convert to the ASA rules and get rid of the the $30,000 race engines."

I apologize.

 

It is strange that when you are are tring to complain about a certain cost, you start quoting brand new top of the line prices. When you show up at the track, it is used. If a used car is competitive, why buy new? Is is that some people want to expose to everyone how much they paid for their car or engine? Sounds like it.

[lendo38]

We are currently using rev limiters and chips that the track provides. It is a very effective way to keep the cheaters in check. There is no advantage for cheating up your motor when all are equal.

[arts22]

Larry, alot of the SLM teams have another car just for TMS, there was a motor for sale on TSZ for $30k that came out of Richardson's car..... If you plan on being competitive it is going to cost you alot more than a $22k-$25k used slm. Call Ray Little and see what his price is on building you a 9 to 1 or concept motor.(817)784-5461 RayMax Machine

 

Teams are paying $12k for Late Model motors(wet sump)......

[CommonSenseRacing]

Larry, I would not buy a new car, I would buy everything used. I want to start racing again, but until they get there act together and there is some stability, I just can’t justify spending the money.

 

I’ll tell you exactly what I was looking to do, here’s an example of a car I found.

 

Item For Sale: LMSC for sale .. 2005 childress front clip with all new suspension. Fast Burn crate motor.Tex Powell trans,Winters quick change rearend, 2quick shocks, lajoie seat, Race ready as it came off the track. $8800 Getting out of lmsc...

 

I’m not saying this is going to be a wining car, but as a starter car with the right person and right set up, probably would be a competitive car. I know you can make the argument about racing to win, I’ve done it and at this point I want to go have fun.

 

Hey arts22, do you feel the crate motor you ran was the right way to go?

[arts22]

Hey arts22, do you feel the crate motor you ran was the right way to go?

CSR, yes it was. Not all of them but most of the others (305 motors) are wanting to go that route. The crate motor trucks were all fast trucks....

 

On the $8800 LM... You could find a truck for that, but to run up front you would have to put that much into it...

[supertx]

Hey Arts 22 seem like you know alot about the slm engines and the cost how many of the $20,000engines have you bought? $5400 man I bet that is one great race engine it ought to make at least 400hp WOW what power. Man my grocery getter makes mors power than that what are they going to call the SLM series Sissey Late Models lol just kidding I just think that there is a place or series for experinced late model drivers,crew cheifs,and car owners can go race with there tallent and run fast after all SLM is the top in shot track asphalt racing.

[tsrsfan]

Lots of factory cars and pickups with more than 400 HP now.

[REBELRACER]

I think that it is nice to go to the track and see big rigs, teams with multiple cars, motorhomes, toterhomes and things like that. You feel like you are getting your moneys worth watching first class people who have worked hard to get where they are in racing.

 

and the best part is seeing John Kelly with his pickup truck and his open trailer going out and winning the race..........the fancy motor homes and fancy haulers dont make the cars any faster, but it sure makes the parking lot look pretty............

[lendo38]

I think that it should be about building up racing in Texas, regardless of the horsepower in the car. It needs to be something that is impressive to the fans. I know that the Supers are impressive to the fans. I agree that they need to have their own class. The next thing that we need to do is build a strong Late Model class "under" the Super Late models that we can grow and develop big car counts. That is the most impressive to fans. When they have 20-25 cars on the track racing, the speed in relative at that point anyway. Take the average fan and see if he can tell the difference in a half second.

 

There is a tremendous opportunity for all of us in Texas Late Model racing right now. Since the announcement of the ASA coming to Houston, and now the apparent change of plans, many people are looking at what HMP is going to do. Now would be a great time to make rules packages for HMP - 350 hp cars, TSRS cars, HMP - 400 hp cars and the local late models that are currently at SAS and Thunder Hill that can apply some parody to these series to make them race as equally as possible. Then you set up racing events at Kyle, Houston, San Antonio, and Corpus and invite all of the series mentioned above to race at the event.

 

I think this is a great opportunity. Have the Supers, and then this series as well with big car counts and the people will come and have a blast.

[Guest lidllarry]

Rebelracer,

That is part of the show, believe it or not, people like to see a carnival type atmosphere. Nothing wrong with showing up in a pickup and open trailer. You throw stones at the big show folks probably because you cant join em. But that is part of the show.

[turbotoddie]

I gotta disagree with you Lendo.

 

The ASA sanction for HMP is great. Everyone deserves to race for a purse but suggesting that the rest of Texas should reorganize around what they are doing is a little extreme. SAS has had Nascar for years and the rest of the state didn't change according to them.

 

I don't mean to pee on the parade but until ASA proves worthy and generates a larger car count and a real purse, I don't think we need everyone's rules changed. With Kyle, SAS and CC making common LM rules, this is just as positive move. Until the rules come out, we don't know how TSRS fits but I don't see much problem there either.

 

Basically, if you want to run a crate, its ASA; if you want to travel it is the common rule set or TSRS; if you want to run a crate and travel, USRA?

 

I wish common rules would have come long ago but in reality, these rules are coming about to build dying car counts. I hope with this next round of change, we can have some stability in the rules. I accept that there will always be rule changes but if counts are struggling, keep racers money in their pockets and run what they ran last year. If crates come to our class, I am in trouble. Like myself, many people have engine builders as sponsors and wouldn't save any significant amount of money going to a crate. For me, it would cost more and unlike the big boys, I couldn't buy two or three and keep the one that dynos the best.

 

food for thought

 

thanks

todd farris

turbotoddie