rollercam Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) Thanks to all that attended on 8-29-08 @ HMP. After getting a collection of positive feedback from many of the drivers there will be some motor rule revisions for 2009. This will be a chevrolet powered class only with three options- 1) the current 602 as rules state, 2) IMCA sportmod CHEVY only as the rules for chevys apply, 3) The 450 lift cam ruled 350 chevrolets that are currently run at the tracks here in the houston area-(specifics will be spelled out on this third option on the website soon). You must choose on of the three options but no mix and match. Claim rules still apply regardless of which option you have, so be careful before you put more than 3k in your built motor. The 6200 rpm rev chip will be applied in all three engine options. Along with these motor options we may have to make weight adjustments to keep each option competitive, we will cross that bridge once we can make adequate determinations. A few other notables is there will be no plating the entire under carraige of car, added weight must be mounted above frame rails, no weight may be added to the inside of tubing or frame. Thanks for everyone interest, Brad Dixon 713-894-3748 also at www.limitedmodifieds.com Edited September 2, 2008 by rollercam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hray Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 .......no weight may be added to the inside of tubing or frame. I'm puzzled at what the purpose of this rule is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer61 Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 If I may ask a question, I know I dont run this series but what is the reasoning behind " no plating". Im assuming this is a metric gm frame. Those rails are super weak and open wheel cars tend to jump tires more than other classes. Looks like a problem maybe. jmo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
97car Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Maybe to prevent chopping or channeling of the frame? I don't like the Chevy only rule, but at least they have more options for next year other then a crate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightmoves 99 Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 we don't have a dog in this fight ,but why the chevy only rule??????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollercam Posted September 3, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 No plating the entire under carraige of car, this means sheet metal covering complete underside of car. Nerf bars, ect. are designed to give, filling the bars solid would prevent that. Fords just can't open that can of worms. Plus there just isn't enough fords in the Houston area to justify it. Brad Dixon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truck99 Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 No plating the entire under carraige of car, this means sheet metal covering complete underside of car. Nerf bars, ect. are designed to give, filling the bars solid would prevent that. Fords just can't open that can of worms. Plus there just isn't enough fords in the Houston area to justify it. Brad Dixon I agree with that, but you should reconsider allowing weight to be inserted into main frame rails - the frame rails do a nice job of containing an otherwise nasty missile (when they break away.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speed demon 7 Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 This class is going to be a hit for the racers and the fans. I have one, but I am not able to get it going at this time. I may bring it out a few times next year. I just need to get my priorities straight, which car is going to be my primary ride for next year!!! I hate owning 6 cars and only having 1 driver!!! Brad, good decision on motor rules. Any other changes(body, control arms)? When will we see the final rules package. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightmoves 99 Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 o.k. if there aren't enough fords in the area why exclude them? if they are legal in every other series across the country why are you punishing the few brave (confused) guys that may not have a bowtie to run? i really hope the series does well ,i'm not trying to cause a problem, just curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollercam Posted September 3, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 It won't stop with just bolting lead in the frame, there will be that one person that will put their frame on its side and melt lead all they way down the rail, so nthis was the solution. The motor revisions were to help those who couldn't fund a crate 602 into their racing budget. Speed Demon, the other rules are going to remain other than saftey additions as needed. Big budgets can really make a ford kick everyone tail, this is an economical class structured to keep deep pockets playing in the promod class. Brad Dixon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hray Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 It won't stop with just bolting lead in the frame, there will be that one person that will put their frame on its side and melt lead all they way down the rail, so nthis was the solution. Brad Dixon That's circular reasoning if I ever heard it. These cars are relatively heavy already. We built as lite a car as we could to IMCA Southern Sport Mod rules and it came in at 1950lbs dry. So what if someone wants to fill their frame rail with lead as long as it's secured properly. They will only hurt themselves by having a really overweight car. Brad, I know you are trying to get an economical asphalt class going, but rules like this only confuse and frustrate racers who would otherwise embrace your effort. When IMCA bought Southern Sport Mod, they researched the rules, made minor changes and came up with a class that is not only economical, but is fast enough and fun enough that many of the fast full mod drivers have come over to the class. So much so that the largest class at most tracks is now the IMCA Southern Sport Mods. Why would you not want to attract that whole class to your effort? When Mary Ann started TSRS, she made the rules compatable with the cancelled SAS SS class and the THR limited lates thereby having immediate car count. Not everyone was happy with that decision, but as they say, the rest is history. You should really consider using something like IMCA SSM rules with only modifications applicable to asphalt (ride height, tires, etc). They've already looked at weight (minimum and where it can be located and how attached), motors, trans, rears, roll cage (config and location) etc, etc, etc. This thread truly shows you are frustrating many would be participants, especially the Ford car owners. IMCA has already worked thru that issue. We own 2 IMCA SSM's built to the latest IMCA rules, and as much as I'd like to put them on asphalt, I won't spend the money to convert them to your rules. I'll bet I'm in the majority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockStan Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 Big budgets can really make a ford kick everyone tail, this is an economical class structured to keep deep pockets playing in the promod class. Brad Dixon didnt i see on another post in this one claims will still be in affect ? that kind of rules out the "big budgets" so to speak. i could care less either way but dont punish the guys who already have a ford motor because you are i dont no scared maybe.................... they have the right to race just like everyone else................... just not in your series but i guess that is one good thing about having your own series you can play god seems to be the trend nowadays well good luck to ya oh and the lead thing who cares if they do that as long as it has anchor bolts and does not go over the set percentage not really and advantage there but hell what do i know i have only been building cars for oh 12 or 13 years must be a new thing melt it in the frame rails and say it is all stock i dont know why it has 70% left side weight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
97car Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 I hate to sound this way, but you would be better off to go by the existing sport mod rules and just add the crate and the goodyears, hoosier970,G60, and amercan racerG60s for tires or else this class is bound for the same dismal car count that the current modified class has. Which equals asphalt only rules. TAMS had a better car count before they started the asphalt only style rules, there has been no reason for the dirt guys to convert over when there are more dirt tracks in the state usually with better purses considering all the expense and requirements for the asphalt races. It was more exciting to watch a mix of combinations in the modifieds back then instead of what there is left now, not taking anything away from the drivers, because we do have good drivers, but give the guys some incentive to want to run every now and then,yes your invitational race is a good start. I like what you are trying to do, just offering suggestions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ford27 Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 less rules = more cars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
97car Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 Now that I think about it the guy that tried this a few years back was trying the chevy only approach as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollercam Posted September 3, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 I welcome all interested in participating in the Limited Modifieds at HMP. These rules are structured to economically strengthen the racing in the Houston Area. With the motor provisions that were made most of the limited modifieds will only have to do a minimal amount to get there cars converted to the asphalt. Hray the majority that have contacted me are excited that a rev box and a set of tires is their major off season expense. Feel free to contact me @ 713-894-3748 and I will be more than happy to give you or anyone else in depth reasoning to any of the rules. Brad Dixon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hotrodracer Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 I am glad to see that things have not changed in the last few years. Racers still wine like babies when someone tries to help them save money and provide them with a place to race. Yes I tried to bring the L/M to pavement a few years ago & I even let the Fords run. One ford showed up for 1 pratice & then never came back. So why should you write rules for someone that will not show up. I am sure that if enough Ford Lovers showed up with race ready cars that meet the other rules & werent out in left feild on motor they could race. But there are not enough of them to worry about. As for the rest of the rules. Please read them. They are written so you do not have to change your car all that much.. I took my Limited from pavement to dirt in less than 2 hours work. All Brad is trying to do is keep the big money guys out of the class. Look what happened on dirt. Howard Willis, Paul White, and a lot of other well known Modified drivers are running L/M's also. Why ? Because they have the money to spend to kick your ass. It's called sponser money. Do you have it???? They do. They show up with 2 cars one L/M one Modified. Twice the fun in one night!!!! Do you want that to happen at HMP. There are a lot of drivers in other classes that can bring 2 0r 3 cars to the track because they have the money to buy all of the high dollar stuff to go fast. To sum it all up. Brad is trying to go back to the basic L/M with no trick set ups or trick parts to give anyone an advantage. So either show up & race or stay home & cry!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC57 Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 My only response (at this time anyway ) to all of this is I wish this class would have been available prior to my purchasing a full (dirt) Mod. It would have been an easy decision to me to purchase a Limited and race at HMP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landlord Posted September 4, 2008 Report Share Posted September 4, 2008 I am glad to see that things have not changed in the last few years. Racers still wine like babies when someone tries to help them save money and provide them with a place to race. Yes I tried to bring the L/M to pavement a few years ago & I even let the Fords run. One ford showed up for 1 pratice & then never came back. So why should you write rules for someone that will not show up. I am sure that if enough Ford Lovers showed up with race ready cars that meet the other rules & werent out in left feild on motor they could race. But there are not enough of them to worry about. As for the rest of the rules. Please read them. They are written so you do not have to change your car all that much.. I took my Limited from pavement to dirt in less than 2 hours work. All Brad is trying to do is keep the big money guys out of the class. Look what happened on dirt. Howard Willis, Paul White, and a lot of other well known Modified drivers are running L/M's also. Why ? Because they have the money to spend to kick your ass. It's called sponser money. Do you have it???? They do. They show up with 2 cars one L/M one Modified. Twice the fun in one night!!!! Do you want that to happen at HMP. There are a lot of drivers in other classes that can bring 2 0r 3 cars to the track because they have the money to buy all of the high dollar stuff to go fast. To sum it all up. Brad is trying to go back to the basic L/M with no trick set ups or trick parts to give anyone an advantage. So either show up & race or stay home & cry!!! Paul white drives for whoever lets him!!!!!!!He shows up to the track with a helmet and driving suit and thats it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budman Posted September 4, 2008 Report Share Posted September 4, 2008 THIS IS NUTS! Its everything that has been wrong with asphalt racing for years. Each track develops its own set of rules, independent of other tracks. Then they parade out 8 cars on Saturday night and tell the crowd what a great show they are seeing. Bull S***. Common rules people .............. Common rules! Get together with THR and RUN THE SAME RULES! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker36 Posted September 4, 2008 Report Share Posted September 4, 2008 I agree with everything else thats been said. Why have rules that are different than those of the Sport Mods that run dirt? I dont get it? Your just asking for another TAMS, USRA, ProMods type scenerio. The people who have been coming up with these classes the last few years have let it spiral out of control. There is such a huge number of these cars running on dirt and many tracks for them to run at, why would they want to spend money on a rev box or tires just to come race asphalt? There is no reason for them to have to spend the extra amount of money. The ProMods might as well be callede Super Latemodels now cause only the people with really deep pockets can afford those now. Back when we raced TAMs atleast you could still take a dirt chasis and run (might not get a top 5) but you sure as hell could try. I remember watching Lawerence run a HOT chasis just as good as a lefthander. Either way, why stretch the rules so far away from where your biggest car count would come from (Dirt mods)? Let them run the dirt tire and run IMCA rules, I know that was the original intention of TAMs but there again it got blown out of proportion. Heres a news flash, no one wants to watch a 8 car ProMod race thats dominated by 3 cars. Very, extremely boring. Not to mention, this business of running 6 to 8 classes in a night is crazy. If all 6 to 8 of them had 15-20 cars that would be different. It kills the practice times alotted for every class and really makes your day feel rushed. What happened to the days of people getting 3 practice sessions on Saturday? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollercam Posted September 4, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2008 The rules are easiy enough for one to conform to if they want to come off dirt. It is asphalt a different tire than the 500 is a must. As far as THR I hope it works out well for them, we have our rules that make our car easily compatibale with one another. You run at THR take your rev chip out, you run at HMP stick it back in. These rules were constructed to elimnate alot of down the road problems. I am very fortunate to have more people eager to participate in the Houston Area with the way the rules are constucted than those that aren't. Once again my focus is on the Houston Area, the rules are definitly in reach to work with THR, but I must concentrate the core of my efforts for building the racing program in our local area. Thanks Brad Dixon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Posted September 4, 2008 Report Share Posted September 4, 2008 THIS IS NUTS! Its everything that has been wrong with asphalt racing for years. Each track develops its own set of rules, independent of other tracks. Then they parade out 8 cars on Saturday night and tell the crowd what a great show they are seeing. Bull S***. Common rules people .............. Common rules! Get together with THR and RUN THE SAME RULES! after reading brad's last post I had to quote budman because he is right on the money. two tracks trying the same thing. on is using rules in place to make it easier and quicker to convert. the other is making thier own rules and even though they say they are willing to listen then when you give it they say "I am focused on Houston". like budman said this what is wrong with asphalt racing. if you really don't want your opinion on your "houston area limitied modified" just say so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollercam Posted September 4, 2008 Author Report Share Posted September 4, 2008 An IMCA sportmod motor provision was made when we have no IMCA tracks in our area. Interesting. How much easier can it be know to convert? Maybe having a rule in which the cars must have 10lbs of dried mud on car before pulling on the track would be an effort to make it easier and quicker to convert the cars over to asphalt. Looking forward to working with many of you in 09. Brad Dixon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Posted September 4, 2008 Report Share Posted September 4, 2008 (edited) Maybe having a rule in which the cars must have 10lbs of dried mud on car before pulling on the track would be an effort to make it easier and quicker to convert the cars over to asphalt. thats is one of the most ..... nevermind I will edit myself before nick can. There are IMCA track in the houston area or with in a short drive and houston racers that go to them Edited September 4, 2008 by Nathan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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