Lonesome Ford Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 is a "club based" racing series which: 1. Is a driver owned and operated non-profit organization. 2. Pays the same $ 1st through last but the top 3 get trophies (with the winner's being HUGE) , pole sitter gets a fast qualifier plaque. 3. Has a tire rule which DOES NOT limit you to one seller, provider, or brand. 4. Driver input which is EQUAL amongst ALL registered members. 5. Has a single monthly meeting AWAY from the track. 6. Elects officers each season: President, VP, Treasurer, Recorder 7. Accomodates & "grandfathers in" your existing equipment over a set # of years. 8. Vigorously advertises & promotes the series & teams. 9. Races on BOTH asphalt & dirt! 10. Is in it for the love of the sport, teams, and tracks & NOT for themselves. Are you interested or curious as to how this can be done? . John Kelly Jr Jr. Kelly Racing Ent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RodneyRodriguez Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 sounds like the old C.A.R.A that ran Speed O Rama in the early 80's, that worked pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C_Malin Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 Not to sure fiberglass bodys would hold up on dirt for very long, unless the purse is of equal value. And could the series afford $1500 from 1st through last? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonesome Ford Posted April 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 I didn't specify the class of car, it's a general outline... could be hobby stock cars for that matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingaces Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 SOUNDS GOOD TELL ME MORE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonesome Ford Posted April 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 Not to sure fiberglass bodys would hold up on dirt for very long, unless the purse is of equal value. And could the series afford $1500 from 1st through last? To answer the fiberglass body question ( just for kicks ).... they can be run on dirt, I've seen it done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 That sounds some of what we had and another class had at cc years ago works aslong as every one works together for the common good and some new person always comes along and starts trouble and then the track or tracks get mad and kill them .. [ association] is the word ..most tracks dont like them cuz its union typ and if you was toget mad you could hold the cars from racen ..thats why we made a contract with the manager back then with stipulations on some of the forseen problems ..like i said it worked out great untill someone didnt like something and the new owner had other plans ..but i loved it even when my vote didnt get what i wanted it was for the good of all the class .the car count tripled in two years ..we had off track meetings with drivers and sometime with track officials ..once a month .....and sometimes the drivers need to have thier own meeting and come up with something they can live with ..the tracks need to make money and sometimes dont have the time or the care to make rules that will be good for most .they are afraid of loosing cars ..sometimes its the other way around . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eduk8er Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 I would be interested. But how much entry? Don't know what I could scrape up the first time!! Would it be for V8's? 4's? What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 A few things to think about: 1) Where will the money come from to pay for the trophies, purse, advertising, race administration, tech equipment, tech officials, scorers, office expenses, web site, insurance, travel expenses, legal and accounting expenses, etc. etc.? Unless there is a major sponsor the membership fees and entry fees to members would need to be very high. 2) Who would write the rules? A committee where everyone has equal say? The "equal say" model has never been successful at any track, any series or any other racing organization that I am aware of. If someone can pull that one off, they'd make history. 3) Who would enforces the club technical/competition rules? A committee that votes on rules enforcement? Unless there is a single person designated as the "enforcer" (chief tech), the person or block of people with the biggest vested interest in the organization will dominate the decision-making process. The rest will feel left out and powerless, perhaps leaving the club to find other venues. 4) Who would call the races? A race director seem to be a needed piece of the pie here. And that person probably is not going to do it for no monetary remuneration. 5) Who would write and administer the contracts with the track(s) that would be required? And, similarly, who would be legally responsible for honoring contracts made with the club? Obviously, some legal advice would be needed to come up with a set of bylaws that govern the way the club operates. After all, there will be some pretty significant money flowing through the club from tracks to racers, from sponsors to club, from club to racers, etc,. 6) Where do I sign up? Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProTree Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 TDCA is or was somewhat this way since 1991 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kn1ghtblade Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 This does sound intrigueing..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonesome Ford Posted April 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 Nick, thank you for the insight. I will appreciate any words of wisdom you may have to share on this subject. You have my email, etc etc. I'll be back on l8tr to check on the thread. I wanted to see if it would even generate interest before I started listing details and getting into deep conversation w/ everyone and it looks as if it has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratdaddy Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 I agree with Tommy the TDCA (Texas Dwarf Car Association) is all that and more. They race dirt & asphalt and is a great organization. I would recommend it to anyone who is looking to drive, or even work as an official. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C_Malin Posted April 5, 2007 Report Share Posted April 5, 2007 Not to sure fiberglass bodys would hold up on dirt for very long, unless the purse is of equal value. And could the series afford $1500 from 1st through last? To answer the fiberglass body question ( just for kicks ).... they can be run on dirt, I've seen it done. Oh I am sure it has been done. but the first time someone nails your door, or for that matter any other part of the body it's usually going to get some sort of damage that you cant knock out with a hammer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonesome Ford Posted April 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2007 To start: Thanks for the replys so far. I guess the below #s could be grouped together since they are all directly related to the organization structure itself. I haven't worked out every detail of every aspect by any means. That is why I posted it here in a public forum; to get everyone's input and opinion (don't be too harsh) Afterall, we all love our sport and want to see it grow. 1. Is a driver owned and operated non-profit organization. 4. Driver input which is EQUAL amongst ALL registered members. 5. Has a single monthly meeting AWAY from the track. 6. Elects officers each season: President, VP, Treasurer, Recorder 10. Is in it for the love of the sport, teams, and tracks & NOT for themselves #1: Being a non-profit organization would be beneficial in several ways. A registered non-profit organization CANNOT keep money for itself. Therefore, all monies will be used in the operation of the non-profit (purse, trophies, advertising, etc). A business must turn a profit. A non-profit organization does not, afterall we aren't in it for the money right? If there is a left over balance, we donate it to the charity of our choice for that racing season. (this would also help find sponsors). Who's against racing for a charity??? #4 Driver input is essential whether you win every week or you make 4 races a season. Drivers and teams have different points of view on several aspect of how their "ideal series" would be run. Being dictated to and not listened to isn't going to help a series be successful in our area. In our area (S. Texas or TX for that matter), racing is not a lifestyle it is a hobby. We aren't racing 3-4 nights a week at 3-4 different tracks. I wish it were that way, but sadly it is not. So, having EVERY driver, owner, and crew chief's input on the series is essential to the continuity of the series. #5 Monthly meetings would be a neccessary part of the series. The proper meeting to run the series could not be done at the track during the driver's meeting. Too much noise, people talking to each other during the meeting, etc. The monthly meeting would be officiated by the elected leadership elected (see below) and would consist of procedure, advertising & promotion, rules, and whatever else drivers or crew chiefs may bring up. If there was a discrepency at a previous race, bring it up at the meeting NOT the track. #6 Elected officers would be elected at the end of the season at the banquet and serve in the upcoming season. EVERY SINGLE MEMBER will get a chance to run OUR racing organization. ANYONE can be elected. AH HA! Who's running the show now? Nobody to blame but ourselves! 10. We are ALL in it for the love of the sport, teams, and tracks. We all want to win and we all do in a series like this. Sure, ONE person wins the race, gets the glory, the write-ups, etc. That doesn't disappear in a series like this, but what does materialize is the ability for all of us to control our OWN destiny in our hobby of stock car racing. ----------------- We'll get to the rest of the list when the above is mulled over for a bit 2. Pays the same $ 1st through last but the top 3 get trophies (with the winner's being HUGE) , pole sitter gets a fast qualifier plaque. 3. Has a tire rule which DOES NOT limit you to one seller, provider, or brand. 7. Accomodates & "grandfathers in" your existing equipment over a set # of years. 8. Vigorously advertises & promotes the series & teams. 9. Races on BOTH asphalt & dirt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobbinsSr Posted April 6, 2007 Report Share Posted April 6, 2007 This an interesting class, like a few others on her said that is the way that the TDCA is based, how ever there always seem to be some more into it than others and when things dont go their way the crying starts. Me personaly would like to see a car based on the IMCA SOUTHERN SPORTMOD. this is basicaly a hobby stock car with a modified body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProTree Posted April 6, 2007 Report Share Posted April 6, 2007 is there any racing where somebody is not going to cry about something or somebody?I sure havent found it in 30 something+ years of being involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobbinsSr Posted April 6, 2007 Report Share Posted April 6, 2007 is there any racing where somebody is not going to cry about something or somebody?I sure havent found it in 30 something+ years of being involved. LOL...you are right Tommy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonesome Ford Posted April 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonesome Ford Posted April 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 ok, before the thread gets totally buried #2 Payout - every position pays the same Using hobby stocks, pure stocks, heck, even the trucks as an example for this hypothetical "traveling series", wouldn't it benefit everyone to pay the same from 1st thru last and not stack the $ on the top 3 or even just the winner's purse? This in my opinion would bring back more cars for the next race if the guys who are "mid-pack on back" could look forward to something more than say $20. With everything in place, the payout could be $200 per position with the winner taking home a HUGE trophy and 2nd & 3rd getting some hardware as well. For the guys who win a lot: you still get the win, the glory, the write-up on speedzone and other sites.... and if you have problems... you still get more than $20. With sponsorship for the series in place, the payout could be more... but that's all details. #3 Tires Allow the cars to run on any 8" treaded tire that is used at any of the local tracks as well as a maximum 8" tread width street tires which are available at any auto parts store as well as the multiple $15 tire shops in the SA and surrounding areas. This not only supports the local brands and tracks but could also extend into support for the local economy if tires are purchased from tire shops. I know I know, street tires? Yea, not as fast but then again if everyone is getting paid the same payout, then teams running "race tires" may not purchase a set or 2 for every race. Quoting Ricky Bobby: "With all due respect, and I do mean ALL DUE RESPECT" tires shouldn't have to be bought from a single outlet, especially if there are lower cost alternatives. more later.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waco Racer Posted April 11, 2007 Report Share Posted April 11, 2007 The tire you are referring to may not be able to take the abuse of a heavy stock car on a race track. There is a reason why series and tracks choose certain types of tires. I like what you are suggesting, it sounds alot like what I participate in with NASA & SCCA. It is good to allow everyone racing to have some input into the series, but, there always needs to be someone to lead the main focus of the series. Racer interest ebbs and flows with the economy, weather, love life, or whatever. You always have to have a leader and when there is one leader or even a board of leaders there will always be a racer that disagrees with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonesome Ford Posted April 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2007 Good point about using street tires. Most people would opt to use the 8" treaded racing tire anyhow, I just added it as an option. No need to turn away cars because they can't find take offs or afford $425 for a set of tires. As far as a "leader" goes, see the thread: "Attention Former USRA Truck Drivers and Owners" in the same forum here. Rusty is a stand up guy who can get some things done. There's a meeting being held for the truck guys at his shop in Austin Sat. April 14th. I honestly don't see why this format for a series couldn't be used for the trucks as well. I just wish I could be at the meeting. *Another benefit of equal payout: Everyone looks for race sponsors. The money is split through the field evenly and everybody wins! What if 2 or 3 guys pick up a sponsor for a single event? Who knows, maybe everybody would be paid a "winners purse" <shrug> This would help the guys down on their luck that particular night, or that have sub-par equipment but just love to race recoup more of the costs of racing. We'd all work together finding sponsors for our series all knowing that the $ will be distributed equally among the drivers of that particular event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted April 12, 2007 Report Share Posted April 12, 2007 the even pay deal sounds good .../ but in the end you could end up with $50 race cars .meaning .a driver comes out with a really cheap car .and collects even money with a guy that has a 10.000 plus car .and makes money .what do you thing that $10.000 racer is going to do .get a $ 50 car ..before you know it there is no more races cars as we know them ....just drive way junkers ..... could go both ways here make the car count go sky high . or junk yard bottom ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landlord Posted April 12, 2007 Report Share Posted April 12, 2007 I'm thinking half would bust their butt to get sponsors and half would set back and feed off their hard work!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txenergy Posted April 12, 2007 Report Share Posted April 12, 2007 I'm thinking half would bust their butt to get sponsors and half would set back and feed off their hard work!!!! Lonesome Ford, How long have you been wanted to do this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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