NickHolt Posted September 13, 2012 Report Share Posted September 13, 2012 2001 Olds Intrigue with 135K miles. Still humming along as a daily driver with only a few minor problems over the years except for having to replace power window stuff all the time. Here's the problem: I put the key in the ignition. Turn it to ACC. Every once in a while, not all the time, all the lights on the dash go out for a second or two then come back on for a second or two then go back out for second or two, etc, etc. It seems to be in the same timing as a turn signal would be if it were on. So, when the ignition turns on and off like that, the starter only engages for a half second or so, before ignition turns off and I sit there hoping the next time I turn the key it will start. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. Other times that weird pattern of off and on ignition in time with the turn signal pattern is not there, and the car will start normally. I have a feeling I need a whole new steering column, but I figure one of you might have a simple cure. The car has 135K miles on it, so I'm not really anxious to spend a fortune to fix it since it's Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted September 13, 2012 Report Share Posted September 13, 2012 NICK THIS IS A GOOD ONE ....SORTA GHOSTLY ... LOOKS LIKE IGNITION SWITCH .I AM THINKING YOU CAR HAS A CHIP ON THE KEY ..MAYBE LOOSE ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesHigdon Posted September 13, 2012 Report Share Posted September 13, 2012 It sounds a lot like you're momentarily loosing power from the ignition switch but the multi-function (turn signal, wiper, cruise, etc.) switch or a bad BCM (body control module) could cause similar issues. When you say you turn to ACC before you start do you mean turn to RUN then to START? Have you noticed any of the lights on the outside of the car acting strange; staying on when the car is off, some lights not working, etc? Does the car ever have a security light on the dash that stays on? We've seen late model GM cars do some seriously strange stuff as the electrical systems start to age but typically its one problem and the parts are cheap so it shouldn't be a huge ordeal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KISS_Racing Posted September 13, 2012 Report Share Posted September 13, 2012 NICK THIS IS A GOOD ONE ....SORTA GHOSTLY ... LOOKS LIKE IGNITION SWITCH . Nick, Sorry I was crosseyed when I read this early this morning. I'd say ignition switch, contacts in steering wheel (I'd have to look at a diagram or picture of steering wheel assembly) or in F5 case I'd look at junction block/harness where it meets the bottom of the steering column. Since the ign/starter and dash lights(dimmer) all are controlled by ignition switch it is right in there somewhere. A little trial and error... Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F5RACING Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 Does it have a factory or aftermarket alarm? I have seen these cause strange issues even if they have been "disabled" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted September 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 No aftermarket alarm. Someone PM's me and told me to unhook the battery and leave it unhooked for a day, or so. I did that and since then the problem has not re-surfaced! That was about two weeks ago. Of course, that could simply be a coincidence and tomorrow the problem could be right back. I don't feel at all confident that the issue has been resolved and tend to agree with the folks who think the wiring in the steering column and/or ignition is the problem. Time will tell. Thanks to all who chimed in on this. I'm a dunce when it comes to stuff like this. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pappy_GT13 Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 The VATS system can cause the problems you describe. Check out this website that sells a module to completely bypass the VATS. http://newrockies.com At $179 it is probably the cheapestway to solve your issues. HTH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesHigdon Posted September 20, 2012 Report Share Posted September 20, 2012 The VATS system can cause the problems you describe. Check out this website that sells a module to completely bypass the VATS. http://newrockies.com At $179 it is probably the cheapestway to solve your issues. HTH. Thats a GREAT deal, we typically go in with a programmer and turn off VATS or Passlock (for $150 plus tax) when needed but I don't know of any equipment besides EFI Live which will work on that car so there you go. If unhooking the battery fixed it temporarily then there is a VERY good chance it's a VATS issue. The temperature drop has likely helped but not cured your problem, there is some chance it will not resurface until spring! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KISS_Racing Posted September 26, 2012 Report Share Posted September 26, 2012 Nick/All, Very Good point. If VATS system has problems reading key(chip) it would start for a split second then die, not start at all or do weird (stuff) as it had been doing. Good pick up on that. I was extremely sleep deprived at that point. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neon14 Posted September 27, 2012 Report Share Posted September 27, 2012 I dont remember what year they did away with the key resistor, but if its a connection problem in the key switch with the resistor in the key you can bypass it pretty easy. Measure the resistance of the key resistor and solder an equal value in place under the dash to the 2 wires going to the key tumbler. Done it hundreds of times to add remote starters back in the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KISS_Racing Posted September 27, 2012 Report Share Posted September 27, 2012 I dont remember what year they did away with the key resistor, but if its a connection problem in the key switch with the resistor in the key you can bypass it pretty easy. Measure the resistance of the key resistor and solder an equal value in place under the dash to the 2 wires going to the key tumbler. Done it hundreds of times to add remote starters back in the day. Yes sir, done this many times too... Good cheap way of fixing it. Nick we need a <like button> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwmbishop Posted September 27, 2012 Report Share Posted September 27, 2012 I dont remember what year they did away with the key resistor, but if its a connection problem in the key switch with the resistor in the key you can bypass it pretty easy. Measure the resistance of the key resistor and solder an equal value in place under the dash to the 2 wires going to the key tumbler. Done it hundreds of times to add remote starters back in the day. You then also remove the resistor from the key as well? Or does having MORE resistance work differently than less? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KISS_Racing Posted September 27, 2012 Report Share Posted September 27, 2012 I dont remember what year they did away with the key resistor, but if its a connection problem in the key switch with the resistor in the key you can bypass it pretty easy. Measure the resistance of the key resistor and solder an equal value in place under the dash to the 2 wires going to the key tumbler. Done it hundreds of times to add remote starters back in the day. You then also remove the resistor from the key as well? Or does having MORE resistance work differently than less? Leave key as is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neon14 Posted September 28, 2012 Report Share Posted September 28, 2012 I wasn't very clear on exactly how to wire this. I always left the resistor in the key. Under the dash I cut the 2 wires, taped off the wires going to the key tumbler, and soldered a resistor across the 2 wires going to the computer. If you left the wiring connected to the tumbler and soldered a resistor across them you would have 2 resistors in parallel (when the key is in the ignition switch), that would double the resistance and the car wouldn't start. I wonder if this car even uses the resistor key system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1-Crew Posted September 29, 2012 Report Share Posted September 29, 2012 Actually it cuts the resistance in half, but the result is the same.. Had similar issues with the wife's 1999 Buick (including windows), problem fixed itself when the intake manifold warped and filled a cylinder. Hydraulic lock and a bent rod the next morning and no more problems.. BTW, if it is the VATS, the car will not start on several retries but the system resets in about 20 minutes. This is a good clue if it is the problem that when it does not start, and repeated retries do not work, come back in 20 minutes and try again. If it starts, it is VATS.. Anyone need a new left rear window regulator for 1999 Buick Regal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesHigdon Posted September 29, 2012 Report Share Posted September 29, 2012 The VATS system on these cars uses a resistor in the lock cylinder itself with a pickup in the surrounding VATS module. After thinking about this the issue is likely a BCM related problem as it is the only system that ties the multifunction switch, VATS and dash lights all together. On these cars everything runs through the BCM as far as lighting, horns, starting, entertainment and security systems. A scanner that can login to the BCM could pretty easily find the issue or you can see if the 12v starting signal is coming out of the BCM when it's being sent in. We actually had very similar issues on an 02 Monte Carlo that had been shot through the door as the bullet hit the BCM and caused a short...watch what side of Houston you drive in at night! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwmbishop Posted September 30, 2012 Report Share Posted September 30, 2012 With all the stuff I have worked on - I have never had to triage a bullet wound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neon14 Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Actually it cuts the resistance in half, but the result is the same.. Had similar issues with the wife's 1999 Buick (including windows), problem fixed itself when the intake manifold warped and filled a cylinder. Hydraulic lock and a bent rod the next morning and no more problems.. BTW, if it is the VATS, the car will not start on several retries but the system resets in about 20 minutes. This is a good clue if it is the problem that when it does not start, and repeated retries do not work, come back in 20 minutes and try again. If it starts, it is VATS.. Anyone need a new left rear window regulator for 1999 Buick Regal? Yeah your right, it cuts the resistance in half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KISS_Racing Posted October 3, 2012 Report Share Posted October 3, 2012 Actually it cuts the resistance in half, but the result is the same.. Had similar issues with the wife's 1999 Buick (including windows), problem fixed itself when the intake manifold warped and filled a cylinder. Hydraulic lock and a bent rod the next morning and no more problems.. BTW, if it is the VATS, the car will not start on several retries but the system resets in about 20 minutes. This is a good clue if it is the problem that when it does not start, and repeated retries do not work, come back in 20 minutes and try again. If it starts, it is VATS.. Anyone need a new left rear window regulator for 1999 Buick Regal? Yeah your right, it cuts the resistance in half. Darn ohms law. It will bitecha if your not careful.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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