"TURKEY TROT II"

[speedracer34]

Man was it a long night! And colddd!!! The racing was good, and alot of accidents, though hopefully everyones alright today. I did see several questionable calls,mainly in the c-main for modified .The main reason I noticed them was because we were on the recieving end and wound up with a tore up race car. We still love the track and track operators! Just hard to swallow sometimes, "THATS RACING". Paul White was awsome! The #1H was carrying and bouncing his front LEFT about 2-3 ft off the ground! Just to hang on to that car was impressive. GREAT RACING FROM SIMS,PURE,MODS!

[MadRacing19]

It was pretty good racing in the Modified cars but the Purestock,Outlaw Bombers need help. The class is so far apart that the Outlaw Bombers out class the purestocks.Either way all classes had great car count.Darin #26 I hope your ok, I know your car is "SICK" .

[Racer26]

Sick ain't the word, try totaled. Starting the new car this weekend. It will take less time to put my cage in another car than fix that wreck.

[TobaGuy]

I spent alot of time walking around looking at other cars at this race and the one thing I can say is I didnt see a car that was built from bumper to bumper for all out racing. Some had good motors but couldnt handle, some could handle but had very little motor and then some obviously dont take the time to knock out the dents and maintaine the car much less wash it and keep the appearance presentable. I am not knocking anyone nor their cars but before you can even compare the two groups you must first do the obvious and thats take care of your cars. Of the 8 TOBA cars only 1 had a parts malfunction and that was a radiator hose. Our guys over the last two years have upgraded the way they take care of their equipment so they can focus on handling and tuning the motors better. In some ways I think you guys had us out ruled. Remember we run very small cams, open chambered heads, street tires and all of us weighted well over the 3475 because that was what we were told prior to coming to the track. My car went across the scales at 3763 prior to fueling up. The #09 car proved you guys can be fast because he was hanging with us. Look forward to next year!

[Racer26]

Tobaguy,

The 09 you refer to was one of our cars from the super stock class. Remember thats the class you were to run with this year but you canceled due to gas prices being to high. They weren't to high to run with the purestocks though. I spent time looking at your cars as well. Since when do you take the rear fender wells and stock rear fire walls out of purestocks. Our cars are PURESTOCKS. That's what we came to race. As for cars being dented up, these are cars that run weekly and have all season. Its hard to replace panels that fast. Your series runs once or twice a month, makes it a lot easier. As for engines we are allowed 15" @ 800RPM and open chambered 194 heads (no 305's). That's not much. Not trying to be rude, just don't like your come to our track one time attitude. Not the kind of attitude I expect from someone running a series. As for looking forward to next year, the purestocks are getting less rules than this year. You should really have no problem.

[dancer52]

Racer26, only 1 (maybe 2) of the cars that showed up had the rear fender wells and rear stock firewall removed.... but if you looked you would have noticed that they had to add weight back in the same spot, this rule is just for ease of maintenace, not performance.... besides the point that neither the 52, 48 or the 13 were removed. Our engine rule is almost the same as yours, 15" vac and 1.94 open chamber heads.... 305 heads are allowed but none of the fast cars run that option. I was planning on running my car when I thought the rules were I37 pure stock only because it would pass your local rules anyway. AJ

[Racer26]

Dancer,

Your car looked closer than others. Ours are not gutted other than the hood and trunk. Stock shocks. The corpus cars are the same. Theres a big difference when you remove weight and add it where you want it. Maybe that's why your series is starting an actual purestock class next season to go along with the outlaw bombers. You have to admit, your cars are no where near a bomber.

[dancer52]

I agree our cars are far from a bomber, but so are yours, I am just saying that the TOBA cars were close enough to your stock rules that it should have been a close race. The car I brought and the 48d were not gutted at all.... now my regular outlaw bomber is VERY gutted but guess what, I had to add it all back in pretty much the same places I took it off.... we get this same complaint every where we run (from the locals) that our cars are too fast... we even had this problem last year when the only difference was a beadlock.... you need to look at the guys driving, it seems like half are track champions from somewhere, if you race with guys like that every week you are going to get better. oh well, sorry about your car, good luck next year... if this race is run next year we will probably be there...just because it is fun (not for the payout) AJ

[TobaGuy]

I can honestly tell you this. My car is 3763 per your scales without a hood and fuel in it at the time. I run stock engine location, radiator core support, stock firewalls both front and rear, stock fender wheels in the back. My top and trunk are not gutted only the hood and part of the doors. The doors still have factory hendges along with the trunk. It also has the stock floor pan inside the car and trunk. So with that said my car has absolutely no advantage per your, toba or anybody elses rules for that matter. The car is fast because when I race it its 110% ready with no questionable parts. I race to win and have alot of fun doing it espicially when I get to race with friends like last weekend. I also have 21 years of racing experience, I dont have the sponsors nor the funds to step up in class as I have done that before but found myself back in the grass roots having the most fun anyways. So even with the Real Outlaw cars coming and having gutted out bodies and whatever else that you feel is an advantage cant beat me in my true pure stocker then I guess the real question is this. Does all of the difference really mean anything? Well I can say this it does make it easier to clean the car plus easier to work on it plus easier to do your normal maintance. The most important part is this when you pore alot of time into a car you tend to have pride in it therefore will make it look good and keep it looking good. Racing weekly is no excuse for some of those cars to look like a jalopy with bumpers sticking out waiting for a fresh tire to come along to cut off. Race tracks should mandate at least to be able to identify what kind of car it is supposed to be other wise you shouldnt race. If you dont care what your car looks like then you probably dont care what happens to it on the track and what it does to other cars. My two cents because the rules are by no means the reason why TOBA cars finished 1st - 5th.

[rebelracewriter]

Toba guy, I don't know why your cars kicked butt big time, but I can tell you this. The person posing these concerns, racer26, was the 2004 I-37 track champion and during mid-season had an extended winning streak. While his car may not be the prettiest thing on wheels, I can assure it comes to the track well-prepared every time he rolls through the gates. For him to get beat as bad as he did in the heat and was in the main, is certainly a legitimate question. Granted some of you guys have more experience, but in talking to the winner, he told me it was only his second year of racing. I have neither the time or inclination to check into everyone's rules packages, but certainly your cars outran the tracks hot dogs for whatever reason.

 

Respectfully,

[TobaGuy]

As many others would also but I know of myself and A.J. would be happy to do a comparison, invest alittle time to actually come up with some good factual reasons. Obviously both sides would have to share some information about each others cars. I for one would be happy to tell anyone exactly what I race with and whats under me. I am sure the info would be benefitial to somebody. I am surely not knocking anyone but yes the guy that won has two full years but he also has about 50 years of experience helping him in the garage setting up his car week in and week out. A.J. has driven for many years himself I am thinking around 15 or so from bombers to late models, I have ran sprint cars and pretty much any type of fendered car. #1h has just recently stepped out of his limited modified ride to run TOBA as he is a Houston Area Top Driver, Both the #77 and #13 ran for TOBA Rookie Points Championship finishing 1 and 2 and Robert my brother in #48 yellow nova also has run for 15 years. The one thing TOBA brings is alot of racing experience and as you know some guys can drive a dump truck to the front its just the talent they have. TOBA has across the board currently the toughest overall field to qualify for. As the year went on we have had as many as 15 drivers capable of winning any night at any track. It may not be fair to have rookie or other pure stock drivers compete against this type of talent but the way they got to where they are is running against the best. That is what you guys did this weekend running against #52 A.J. as he is not only the last years race winner but TOBA's points champion. Hard nosed drivers and good tough clean racing sure makes it exciting for everyone. Again I would be happy to try to put my two cents together I am sure Dancer would help to come up with exactly what we think are the biggest difference on and off the track. Please let me know I would like to help.

[TobaGuy]

The #13 TOBA car was totalled in the wreck he was involved in with me and the #74 car. We have already started on his new car several weeks ago and currently have what I am estimating over 250 hours in it and we are about 30% into finishing the project. The car after being disassembled and turned into a race car will have every single nut and bolt removed, replaced or changed before its done from bumper to bumper. I am not sure what it means but you can get an idea of what kind of time goes into our cars. Myself and another guy will work on it 5 to 7 hours each week day with our goal of being finished will be last week of January. Sure hope this one last longer hehe, we learned alot from his car in the wreck so it may survive or have a better chance in the next bad wreck.

[rrracing]

Ladies Ladies lets not cry over spilled milk or a race that has already past if Some Drivers should have could have and would have if they could go back in time. The rules were made to be fair. If you did not win because you spun in your heat by yourself or for whatever reason you did not win it is over. I was a great race won by less than a bumper but there is no sense in crying about rules now. I personally looked at every car from to to bottom and with Frank and found no advantage with the TOBA cars I even was at the scales when they rolled across the lightest one weighed in at around 3400. Now as for the 09 Darrin you obviously did not look at the car real good because it had everything stock on it. Dont you remember that was Whitakers old car and was orginally a pure stock to begin with. I think alot of the Driver showed in this race instead of the car.

 

So lets stop whinning about rules and about whos cars look ugly or good.

All I could say was it was a DAMM GOOD RACE!!!

 

Randy Guzman

[Racer26]

Randy,

 

Getting beat wasn't my main concern here. The fact the guy trashed all of your local cars was my concern. Maybe the track feels that way about the cars as well? I seem to be the only one who cares. I'm only one person working on mine and have no crew. My wife and 7 year old son help me. When I get to the track other crews help. I can't keep mine looking good all season with the time I have. It is on the other hand ready to race. As for the 09 Randy, I know that car. It ran SS all season not purestock. Theres a lot of reasons it ran SS.

[rebelracewriter]

Randy, I don't really think anyone's crying here, just concerned, as you(the track) should be. Your local guys are the ones that support you all year long, if you expect them to race these big shows, they need to feel the playing field is level. Otherwise they won't be there.

I think it's good that the TOBA guys are open to finding the biggest differences, whatever they may be. If does come down to pure driver ability, then so be it. The local guys will just need to step up to the plate. If there are diffences in the car/motor/whatever then perhaps you need to look at either some restrictions or more weight in the future. Though the thing about weight is static weight vs. transferable weight.

 

You, as a driver, shouldknow that it sucks when you take a knife to a gun fight. LOL

[TobaGuy]

Randy26 I am not trashing anyone. You wanted answers on why we are as fast as we are so I gave you the most honest answer I could without investigating deeply. From the appearance of most cars they didnt look maintained however if they were all in good running order underneath then great but you do have to admit very few of the locals went out and ran strong in their heats for whatever reason. We had 4 of our cars off the pace in their heats as well but were able to collectively get them up to speed prior to the B Feature. I would be happy to look into it farther for you or anyone else. Maybe its final drive maybe its chassis setup. One thing for sure is I thought the motor rules were pretty level and maybe it was maybe it wasnt. However per the rules for that race on paper it does look fair to me and I am looking at it from both points.

[JohnnyT66]

the 09 moved up to supers at my request to help the track out with car count at the time.as did the 74. the cars were not up front runners in that class,but it helped with the numbers.the 09 ran 3 races in the class....we heard the same thing about 74 when it moved up to help.but it had no weight jacks as reported,it will pull 24 inches of vacume,open chamber 882 heads,no headers,and won where it belonged.i do and did take care of our drivers,when steve whitaker out ran and out drove the racers in pures there were all sorts of racers crying,i was racing then,my comment to his defense was to tell drivers to work harder to beat him.i still feel this way today when i get beat.i respect all our drivers,but i could point out many flaws that took place this weekend on why.the main one gearing....many of our cars were in left field.they may have sounded good to the driver.put they only pulled for the first 20 yards.

[rrracing]

Darin If you stop and read my post over I said So lets stop whinning about rules and about whos cars look ugly or good. I dot care if a car is a ugly junker it could still go out and win races. Darin you take everything so personal.

 

Now Reb I dont know if you were behind me a Frank when we look at the TOBA cars from underneath to on top but they were pertty simple cars. As you are right about weight but you know what it takes a guy who knows his car to put it in the right place. As there was no weight rule on that. However the TOBA cars were given weight penalties for certain things. Also it does not matter if you are a Track Champion or a Rookie If you remember correctly Red I was the Pure Stock Track Champion as well 2 Times and had an extended winning streak as well. But when I went to big shows or other tracks and got my butt handed to me i worked harder to get it right and race again not sit and cry on how illegal the other cars were. Alot of people think OK I will put some headers and alot of gear or do little changes a be competitve but it does not always work if the car is not right.

[TobaGuy]

Good messages guys. I have alot of respect for grass roots tracks such as yours verses some of the big nice tracks we have in houston. Its takes alot to put on races and alot to run in them. Congrads to both for doing the job they did this past weekend.