CC57 Posted September 14, 2012 Report Share Posted September 14, 2012 Hello there HMP. Before I change the R&P in my truck (the ratio I'm runing isn't quite working out the way I expected/wanted), is there any truth to the rumors for 2013 the Trucks may be able to get away from having to run the "overweight, undependable, expensive to configure for racing" T-350s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legfixr Posted September 14, 2012 Report Share Posted September 14, 2012 shite, for a moment there I thought you were talking about me, then I saw transmission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legfixr Posted September 15, 2012 Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 so on a more serious note. Reliability or not They are getting very hard to find, which makes them expensive for cores and builds. What is the word out there on WHY NOT POWERGLIDES. really a good techinical reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T3Motorsports Posted September 15, 2012 Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 I would prefer the Powerglide over the T350. I believe the transmission rule needs evaluated. Several this year have spents nights under their trucks pulling and installing transmissions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trotter1t Posted September 16, 2012 Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 it would be less expensive, and more safe to run a direct drive transmission like a falcon or racegator. You don't have a converter to come apart and eat your legs or feet. ;-) sorry legfixer. And no automatic trans fluid screwing up the track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC57 Posted September 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 John, I see you there "lurking". Come on, what say thee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houston Motorsports Park Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 I know I am not the smartest guy, but I am not dumb enough to let ya'll bait me into a "rules discussion" on a public internet forum. I will say that we will give it some serious review. Anyone with constructive feedback for or against would be best suited to send me an email, call me or talk to me in person. For my own sanity, this will be my last response here on this subject. email is john@houstonmotorsportspark.com cell is 713-826-3313 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZIPPYHIPPY Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 Saginaw 3 speed w/ pro clutch....Cheaper than Automatic and you will never have to touch it again after install ( No Track Mess ) I spent 4 cents on this suggestion.....Internet & Electric Fees etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolliepollie Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 What size clutch would we go with Hippy, and how would we measure that clutch? lol I just could not resist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZIPPYHIPPY Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 What size clutch would we go with Hippy, and how would we measure that clutch? lol I just could not resist. I am sure Jack will come up w/ something to measure it Pick a clutch ( 7 or 8 inch 3 disc minimum for example ) Go for it Rollie I know you have a suggestion what do you think ? I could not resist .... keep this thread alive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maverick Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 racegator is made in China. Install with caution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolliepollie Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 I agree that we should go to standard trans. I have five trucks in my shop each week and they all leak. Not only would the trucks run faster but the Mods would have a better track to run on as well. However be sure to include rear gear in your cost est. I know this has been talked about for years but it always comes down to the cost. While I think everybody from racer to management would like to see this change, it still comes back to cost. Not that there is any thing wrong with giving your four cents worth but most still can only give their two cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobby22 Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 run the stock car rules! but that would be to easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truck99 Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 I'll email my thoughts to John separately, but for the benefit of this discussion: Rough estimate to switch to a stock manual tranny with stock type transmission like the HMP stock cars (includes tranny, flywheel, clutch and disc, bellhousing, hydraulic throwout bearing with pedal and cylinder, and new rear end gears to get the right final ratio): $1600 Rough estimate to switch to a clutchless type tranny (Falcon is what I used - includes tranny, bellhousing, starter, rear end gears): $2150 If any change at all is warranted, it seems like the most reasonable would be to adopt the Stock Car transmission and clutch rules. However, I'm not really convinced that is even necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC57 Posted September 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 "Rough estimate to switch to a stock manual tranny with stock type transmission like the HMP stock cars (includes tranny, flywheel, clutch and disc, bellhousing, hydraulic throwout bearing with pedal and cylinder, and new rear end gears to get the right final ratio): $1600 Appreciate the input Chase.I was going to ask others for their cost estimates on this. I didn't have any idea. And I'm surprised, as this seems higher than I expected. Rough estimate to switch to a clutchless type tranny (Falcon is what I used - includes tranny, bellhousing, starter, rear end gears): $2150 It's been a couple of years since I've shopped for a similar tranny, but ~4 years ago I purchased a "used" Brin, including bellhousing, reverse mount starter, and flyywheels) for $1k. Plus the $250 for a cluth rebuild, and the ~$100 for the clutch pedal and cylinder... Total $1,350. Would think (but I'll start looking) similar deals can still be had for Brinns, Falcons, Berts.. ....However, I'm not really convinced that is even necessary. I'm basing my "need" from: ; just how much do some people currently have invested in the tranny & torque convertor? Yes, I know how people tend to exaggerate, but I’ve heard numbers thrown around that would rival your stick manual tranny cost. ; personal experience and discussion with another half-dozen truck owners. I started off this season with a “freshened and checked out” T-350. Plus a "healthy" investment in a new torque convertor. (I hate DNFs due to mechanical failures, so I was trying to do what I thought was preventative maintenance). I’ve now had to pull the tranny twice to work on it. I might be more concerned with the tranny shop I use, but I’m not alone with regards to others who have similar experiences, utilizing different tranny shops. ; over time a “made for racing” unit such a Bert or Brinn will be more cost effective. Change the oil (3/4 of a quart) in them every other race. And new clutch plates at the end of the season. And you’re covered for quite a few seasons. Don’t think a T-350 can stand up to what they’re put through each season for that minimal investment. Or can they? I sincerely don’t know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC57 Posted September 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 I know I am not the smartest guy, but I am not dumb enough to let ya'll bait me into a "rules discussion" on a public internet forum. John, my intent is/was not to bait you into a rules discussion. Just looking for some input from the track so I can make a decsion on a R&P change or not, that's all. Trust me on this (just don't judge me by the company I keep ... ) I'll give you a call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truck99 Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 Robert, I know your intentions are good, but a rule change like this could very well price a few folks out of racing a truck. I'm sure there are deals on used Falcons and Brinns to be had, but one can't count on that, especially when you have a limited time window to work in for the conversion. As far as the reliability of the the TH350, our experience doesn't support that it's a problem. Our experience may very well be out of the ordinary, but we've been running the same transmission and converter that came in the truck when we bought it in 2009. It was used then. The only thing I've done is change the fluid and filter periodically. We've had zero transmission related failures except for the shifter cable, and I took care of that. I've never had the case open, but it appears to be a stock case. For us, this would be a case of "fixing" something that isn't broken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC57 Posted September 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 ....For us, this would be a case of "fixing" something that isn't broken. Don't know why, but that is sometimes a difficult practice for me to adhere to... Anyway, I guess my tranny issue(s) is just another point of frustration in what has been for me a frustrating season. Appreciate the dialogue Chase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
looneedude Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 worms worms worms.....saginaws blow up too (broke 3 at hmp in the stock cars twice while leading)......especially when raced in 2nd gear (for 3speeds) and 3rd gear on (4speeds) but yea fix it when its not broke...thats a great idea! highest car count of any class almost every race for the last 2 seasons, side by side and three wide racing and the class needs fixing? when everybody goes to standards can i have all the th350 transmissions? didnt some one write that the th350s are getting hard to find???? hmmmm and saginaws, muncies or super t10s arent getting hard to find? ok faster doesnt mean better racing....usually the top 12 to 20 trucks are within 3tenths.... how about getting rid of the ARTS chassis guidlines since ARTS has been out of business for 10 years??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hray Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 Letting some trucks run an internal clutch trans would be a definite performance advantage for those trucks. They weigh less than 40lbs and practically no rotating mass compared to T350's. But, mandating only the T350 doesn't make sense. A Muncie or Saginaw with a stock flywheel and 10" clutch and explosion proof bellhousing weighs about the same and the rotating mass is close to a T350 and torque converter. My philosophy is give the class as wide a latitude as possible while giving no advantage to any choice like allowing any motor combo by adding penalties to equalize, such as the old weight per cubic inch rule (which has gone out of favor, but worked really well for many years). This helps keep the cost down by allowing each team to decide what's best for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyJack Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 IF YOU RUN A BRINN TYPE TRANS THEY ARE ONE TO ONE, WOULD BE HARD TO FIND CORRECT REAR GEAR WITHOUT GOING TO 9 INCH FORD, CHA CHING I DONT HAVE A DOG IN THIS FIGHT BOBBY JACK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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