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Who, where and when?


texastracker

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Budman, Nick and others, I'm am beside myself about this forum! May it continue until The Lord returns!

 

The track is the old Moody/Cleary Speedway in Navasota. The Year was 1973.

 

Come on Budman! You don't reconize the arms on the driver of the #21?

 

The driver of the #43 is in the Sprint Car Hall of Fame.

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looks like Bill White and he was one to use a wing back then and he should be in sprint car Hall of Fame. He went to the little 500 and finished 2nd in a Jim McElreath. Junior

 

looks like Bill White and he was one to use a wing back then and he should be in sprint car Hall of Fame. He went to the little 500 and finished 2nd in a Jim McElreath car. Junior

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Ding, Ding, Ding, You win tex44!!

 

And yes I strongly agree Bill should be a hall of famer! Not taking anything from the great Gordon Woolley, he was and and still is not only an great driver but an all around great person as well. He and his wife ann still live in my old home town, the big city of Bellmead. You can find him almost daily at the Bluebonnett Cafe on the Dallas Hy.

Gordon stayed on the road much longer than Bill and therefore got the exposure that Bill did not. Gordon won the 1963 IMCA Sprint Car Championship. This was when IMCA Sprints were in their glory years!

 

Bill and Gordon put on some of the best racing my era (i.e. the early to mid 70's). I must also admit that when those two put on their helmets the best Gordon could do was finnish second! But make no miskake about it, IT WAS WAR!

 

One aspect about Bill that I haven't seen on this forum yet, (but I just found yall a couple of days ago). Bill not only would smoke you on the track, if you didn't like the way he passed you rearend, he would take you out often with one punch!!! I have seen this happen! In fact I was told that a young man started a tiff in the little coffee shop in Temple this past year. It just so happens that that is where Bill goes often. Needless to say Bill met him at his car and started to take him out! Even at 81, I would hate to tangle with him.

I have an April 86' issue of "Open Wheel" one of the articles includes the history of Devils Bowl. After talking about all the greats at the Bowl, it says "but no compitition was any tougher than that at Waco. Where Bill White, Gordon Woolley and Waldo Harper did battle." it goes on to mention Gordon was a Hall of Famer, But that Bill had more A-Mains victories than all the othewrs combined! "Bill, always smiling but the toughest of the toughest!" It concludes "one wag said, if he put the iron on you on the track, you DIDN"T go to his pit afterwards, that is for sure." I'm at work and must go for now, Kenny Kemp

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  • 2 weeks later...

As a kid in San Antonio I never knew about Bill White, but I did find out about Gordon Wooley.

 

Sometime in the early to mid-sixties Hot Rod Magazine (or maybe Car Craft) did an article on him. This was particularly notable because the mag never covered any kind of round track, (with the exception of Indy), much less dirt. Had a nice black and white picture of him sideways in a sprinter on a hot dusty track. As I recall the focus was primarily on the nomadic lifestyle, driving and sleeping in his stationwagon.

 

I was only 8 or 9 at the time, but I can still remember one paragraph. Wooley said he never drove over 60 (?) because it "cut the gas mileage in half" or some such dramatic statement. Considering the early 'sixties gas prices this really gives meaning to th term "pinching pennies". Even then it didn't sound like a very appealing lifestyle.

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Here's an interesting little note on Woolley. Some time ago I was browsing a website on the SCRA (Southern California Racing Assn.) and came across Gordon Woolley's name. He was winning weekly features in 1968 at the famed Ascot Park 1/2 mile track in Los Angeles, racing against some of the biggest names ever in west coast sprint car racing. Talk about a "Nomad". He raced all over the place!

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Gordon was know for leaving with a suitcase of clothes and returning with no clothes but full of cash! He had told me a number of good ol racing stories of his hay days, but nun as intresting as the one about the first time he met Jan Opperman. Gordon said "I had the repetation for driving in deeper than anyone at that time". He recalls one event were there was a lot of talk in the pits about the arival of this long haired hippie with a Sprinter. (back then it was crewcuts and country music) Gordon took an early lead, then he began to hear someone approching and whoever this guy was, was staying on the gas longer than he was. About that time the driver got side to side with him. Gordon said "I'll be it's that hippie". The rest is all history! The greatest of all time! (JMO)

 

Bobby, Sorry you never watch Bill and Gordon compete! It was a show for sure!!

 

Edited by texastracker
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  • 4 weeks later...

lucky161, Yes Bill is their dad. He was the best I have ever seen. Paul has had a great deal of success himself. USAC Silver Crown rookie of the year in 99. Champion in 2001. Paul has never really gotten the recognition he should for winning the Championship. There is a couple of reasons for this: 1. In USAC if you are not from Indiana or the Midwest, you can't really race. 2. After the success of Jeff Gordon at such a young age, it has changed racing completey in favor of the young guns. Ryan Newman won the Championship in 99, Paul's rookie year. If your over 25 your not going anywere. Besides everyone knows Texans can't race! Keep a close eye on him this year, currently running 4th in Silver Crown points.

Keith is currently the 2 time definding IMCA National Southern SportMod Champion. (limited modifieds) Keith has had his lions share of A-Main himself, but is quick to tell you he is the third best driver in the family.

Blessings, Kenny

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lucky161, Yes Bill is their dad. He was the best I have ever seen. Paul has had a great deal of success himself. USAC Silver Crown rookie of the year in 99. Champion in 2001. Paul has never really gotten the recognition he should for winning the Championship. There is a couple of reasons for this: 1. In USAC if you are not from Indiana or the Midwest, you can't really race. 2. After the success of Jeff Gordon at such a young age, it has changed racing completey in favor of the young guns. Ryan Newman won the Championship in 99, Paul's rookie year. If your over 25 your not going anywere. Besides everyone knows Texans can't race! Keep a close eye on him this year, currently running 4th in Silver Crown points.

Keith is currently the 2 time definding IMCA National Southern SportMod Champion. (limited modifieds) Keith has had his lions share of A-Main himself, but is quick to tell you he is the third best driver in the family.

Blessings, Kenny

 

Fortunately I've been able to see all three of them race. Not so much Bill as he didn't come to DFW every week when I first started going to races. But I've seen Paul often and he's as good as I've seen and not only does he win a lot, he does it cleanly. This old man I know from Waco says that Keith is actually better than Paul, but I haven't seen Keith as much as Paul. The old man? You might have heard of him. J.T. "pappy" Carpenter!

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Fortunately I've been able to see all three of them race.

 

I am friends with all three, and it would be hard to put one over the other. Paul has the edge in the variety of cars raced, but I think Keith is being modest when he calls himself the third best in the family.

 

One that has not been mentioned here is Ronnie White, Bill's brother. He was as good as the rest of the family, but he never pursued it as hard as Bill did.

You could make a comparison between Bill and Paul, who raced anything, anywhere, at any time, and Ronnie and Keith, who stay a little closer to home.

All four are great shoes, and some of the nicest folks you will ever meet. All of them are very approacheable at the racetrack, and Bill and Ronnie love to talk about racing past.

 

Ronnie also has a little history with drag racing. You can see his ramp truck in the movie "Funny Car Summer" from 1974. Ronnie loaned the truck to the movie crew.

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Fortunately I've been able to see all three of them race.

 

I am friends with all three, and it would be hard to put one over the other. Paul has the edge in the variety of cars raced, but I think Keith is being modest when he calls himself the third best in the family.

 

One that has not been mentioned here is Ronnie White, Bill's brother. He was as good as the rest of the family, but he never pursued it as hard as Bill did.

You could make a comparison between Bill and Paul, who raced anything, anywhere, at any time, and Ronnie and Keith, who stay a little closer to home.

All four are great shoes, and some of the nicest folks you will ever meet. All of them are very approacheable at the racetrack, and Bill and Ronnie love to talk about racing past.

 

Ronnie also has a little history with drag racing. You can see his ramp truck in the movie "Funny Car Summer" from 1974. Ronnie loaned the truck to the movie crew.

 

That's cool to know too. Speaking of Texas drivers in supers and Texas drivers whose brother's were lesser known but still good racers, How about Freddy Fryar. I didn't know until a couple of years ago that Freddy ran supers and that he had a brother that did too.

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lucy161, this thing is going to go full circle! You had to mention "Pappy" J.T. Carpenter. I have some pic's and one great Waco Tribune article on "Pappy". I am not going to post anything on him yet, because his Daughter and Son in Law live 2 house down from me, and I have told them about this forum and asked to post. Therefore I am going to give them some time.

Also my nabour raced for J.T. for many years, Robert Pryor. Robert was a good shue himself. Robert son Mike also raced for awhile and was good as well.

As for as who is better of the White Boy's? I always tell them "I not a Paul or Keith fan, I am a Bill White fan"!!!! Boy, Paul and Keith are, very good drivers. Txtom was right about Paul and Bill both had or have the ability to get into anything with a steering wheel, and be competive or even blow their doors! In fact I has seen Paul get into an inferior car and take it to the winners circle more than once. Bill on the other hand was as good as anyone! And I mean anyone! He was and still is the the best I have ever seen. Bill and Paul are also simular in that when they raced it was never for 2nd. What I am trying to say is, although they are clean drivers, when the money was on the line they will race you hard! For example: They would not have much patience with a lap car blocking them. But Keith is the coolest headed driver! That boy has really kick rearends with that Imca SportMod. Winning over 40 A-main the last 2 years. It didn't take long before people started to hollier "traction control". I tell you the TRUTH, he does have it! His Dad had it, and by golley Paul has it also. It's the brain to the right foot!!!! Keith is always teched harder, and other drivers race him harder than anyone. Some blantently take shots at him, some are even successful. With that said, I have never seen him loose his tempter, and unlike Bill and Paul even lap cars can block him all night if they so choose, if he can't pass ya clean, he wouldn't pass you!

PS. Some mistakenly think George White (a great Texas driver) is related to Paul and Keith. Although Paul and George are like brothers. George was Paul's crew chief (so to speak) when Paul was driving the Silver crown for Paul Cook. George has remained with Cook and they win their share of "big money" Modified shows.

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That's cool to know too. Speaking of Texas drivers in supers and Texas drivers whose brother's were lesser known but still good racers, How about Freddy Fryar. I didn't know until a couple of years ago that Freddy ran supers and that he had a brother that did too.

 

Lucky, if you scroll back through this history forum, you can see pics of several cars Fryar drove, Including Harold's car.

 

I have access to a few more, I post them soon.

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lucy161, this thing is going to go full circle! You had to mention "Pappy" J.T. Carpenter. I have some pic's and one great Waco Tribune article on "Pappy". I am not going to post anything on him yet, because his Daughter and Son in Law live 2 house down from me, and I have told them about this forum and asked to post. Therefore I am going to give them some time.

Also my nabour raced for J.T. for many years, Robert Pryor. Robert was a good shue himself. Robert son Mike also raced for awhile and was good as well.

As for as who is better of the White Boy's? I always tell them "I not a Paul or Keith fan, I am a Bill White fan"!!!! Boy, Paul and Keith are, very good drivers. Txtom was right about Paul and Bill both had or have the ability to get into anything with a steering wheel, and be competive or even blow their doors! In fact I has seen Paul get into an inferior car and take it to the winners circle more than once. Bill on the other hand was as good as anyone! And I mean anyone! He was and still is the the best I have ever seen. Bill and Paul are also simular in that when they raced it was never for 2nd. What I am trying to say is, although they are clean drivers, when the money was on the line they will race you hard! For example: They would not have much patience with a lap car blocking them. But Keith is the coolest headed driver! That boy has really kick rearends with that Imca SportMod. Winning over 40 A-main the last 2 years. It didn't take long before people started to hollier "traction control". I tell you the TRUTH, he does have it! His Dad had it, and by golley Paul has it also. It's the brain to the right foot!!!! Keith is always teched harder, and other drivers race him harder than anyone. Some blantently take shots at him, some are even successful. With that said, I have never seen him loose his tempter, and unlike Bill and Paul even lap cars can block him all night if they so choose, if he can't pass ya clean, he wouldn't pass you!

PS. Some mistakenly think George White (a great Texas driver) is related to Paul and Keith. Although Paul and George are like brothers. George was Paul's crew chief (so to speak) when Paul was driving the Silver crown for Paul Cook. George has remained with Cook and they win their share of "big money" Modified shows.

 

Where to start. I am assuming that the son in law is the one that raced too? Can't think of his name right off, but he raced for quite a while too. Traction control? Must run in the family, I've seen Paul's version of it many many times at Cowtown in Winged Modifieds. When they announce that George White is a local driver at Cowtown, where he still competes, they mean LOCAL. He's from Kennedale. I am looking foward to seeing what else you have on these subjects as well as from your neighbors.

 

 

That's cool to know too. Speaking of Texas drivers in supers and Texas drivers whose brother's were lesser known but still good racers, How about Freddy Fryar. I didn't know until a couple of years ago that Freddy ran supers and that he had a brother that did too.

 

Lucky, if you scroll back through this history forum, you can see pics of several cars Fryar drove, Including Harold's car.

 

I have access to a few more, I post them soon.

 

 

Thanks for the tip and I'll be looking foward to you subsequent posts too.

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Lucky, Take a look at a couple links here--

 

Fryar

 

 

and

 

Fryar 2

 

There are a few more around here with Fryar in them.

 

If you don't know, Freddy is living near Branson, Missouri with a new wife. (Sugarmama, his words)

 

I last saw him about a year or two ago, doesn't get this way much. Does odd pickup jobs in racing when he feels like it, but he is in very good heatlh for 70 years old. I talked to Tommy Martin at the Snowball last December, and he stated that Freddy had stopped in on them last year for a visit. The Martins are in Amite, Louisiana.

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lucy161, this thing is going to go full circle! You had to mention "Pappy" J.T. Carpenter. I have some pic's and one great Waco Tribune article on "Pappy". I am not going to post anything on him yet, because his Daughter and Son in Law live 2 house down from me, and I have told them about this forum and asked to post. Therefore I am going to give them some time.

Also my nabour raced for J.T. for many years, Robert Pryor. Robert was a good shue himself. Robert son Mike also raced for awhile and was good as well.

As for as who is better of the White Boy's? I always tell them "I not a Paul or Keith fan, I am a Bill White fan"!!!! Boy, Paul and Keith are, very good drivers. Txtom was right about Paul and Bill both had or have the ability to get into anything with a steering wheel, and be competive or even blow their doors! In fact I has seen Paul get into an inferior car and take it to the winners circle more than once. Bill on the other hand was as good as anyone! And I mean anyone! He was and still is the the best I have ever seen. Bill and Paul are also simular in that when they raced it was never for 2nd. What I am trying to say is, although they are clean drivers, when the money was on the line they will race you hard! For example: They would not have much patience with a lap car blocking them. But Keith is the coolest headed driver! That boy has really kick rearends with that Imca SportMod. Winning over 40 A-main the last 2 years. It didn't take long before people started to hollier "traction control". I tell you the TRUTH, he does have it! His Dad had it, and by golley Paul has it also. It's the brain to the right foot!!!! Keith is always teched harder, and other drivers race him harder than anyone. Some blantently take shots at him, some are even successful. With that said, I have never seen him loose his tempter, and unlike Bill and Paul even lap cars can block him all night if they so choose, if he can't pass ya clean, he wouldn't pass you!

PS. Some mistakenly think George White (a great Texas driver) is related to Paul and Keith. Although Paul and George are like brothers. George was Paul's crew chief (so to speak) when Paul was driving the Silver crown for Paul Cook. George has remained with Cook and they win their share of "big money" Modified shows.

 

I guess it's a sign of getting old. I said I was trying to remember who JT's son in law was and you had already named him. I just didn't register Pryor until I talked my dad about it. :)

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Lucky, I was about to reply to your question about the Son in Law, but I see that you read it alittle more carefully and found the answer. My post don't help, my brain runs about 3 laps ahead of my fingers!

See Ya, Kenny

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It's funny, or maybe not so funny. I started working in the candy plant in Waco in May 1983. I was 23 years old, and i remember when the plant started to get really automated. It was a computer for this system and then that system, some of the older associates had a real hard time keeping up. Now after 24 years i find myself being one of those people!!!

Blessings, Kenny

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