jp17 Posted August 24, 2003 Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 Caveman brought up an interesting point in chat the other day that I, at first, dismissed but on closer examination it appears he may be on to something. Based on the qualifying times for three series (Romco, TAMS, TSRS) it would appear that SAS is not the fastest track (average speed) that these series compete on. If the published track lengths are correct then HMS would be the fastest track followed closely by SAS, then THR and finally CC Speedway. Try it yourself at: http://chasinracin.com/short-track/lapspeed.shtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerjim2 Posted August 24, 2003 Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 JP what kind of lap times does everyone run in houston? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp17 Posted August 24, 2003 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 Fast times for Romco would be 13.90, TSRS 14.90 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted August 24, 2003 Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 JP.. it all depends on what you use for the track length. SAS is measured at the middle of the track and is a true half-mile. Thunder Hill is 1940 feet around the outside of the track which makes it .367 miles around the outside. Iin other words, THR is a less than 3/8-mile even around the outside. It is more like .33 miles around the middle. Houston is also about .33 mile around the middle and probably about the same length as THR around the outside. CC is a tight quarter-mile, but let's say it is .25 miles around the middle. I am writing to Graham Baker at HMS to see if he has the actual distance from the HMS blueprints. Using these estimated "center of track" lengths and using ROMCO fast qualifying times in 2003 at all four tracks, I get the following results from the Lap Speed Calculator: SAS, 18.316, Brandon Bendele, 5/3/03 = 98.275 MPH HMS, 13.827, Eddy Wallace, 5/24/03 = 85.919 MPH THR, 14.472, Brandon Bendele, 4/5/03 = 82.090 MPH CC, 13.494, Greg Davidson, 4/19/03 = 66.696 MPH Doesn't this look a bit more like what the gear charts and common sense would indicate are the relative speeds obtained at the four tracks we are looking at? Nick Holt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truck99 Posted August 24, 2003 Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 Nick or JP, I'm not very familiar with the lap speed calculator. Are those figures estimating average or top speeds? I ask because I checked a few of the ROMCO cars a couple of years back with a hand-held radar. It was during practice for the first Bigshot race. I was getting 95-105 mph coming down the front stetch at THR. Chase Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jp17 Posted August 24, 2003 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 I figured you'd get to the bottom of it Nick. I bet we'll also learn that HMS is even a little shorter than THR. ss99: I believe the calculator determines average speed. JP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rebelracewriter Posted August 24, 2003 Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 Nick common sense would have you thinking SAS would be faster. But you know how that "new math" works. LOL Using the chasinracin calculator, my 26.87 lap was only 66.989MPH, sure seemed alot faster than that. Guess when you add the "pucker factor"......... LMAO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSTONLM04 Posted August 24, 2003 Report Share Posted August 24, 2003 Houston is also about .33 mile around the middle and probably about the same length as THR around the outside. Nick, I was at the Friday practice for the ASA and attended the drivers meeting. In that meeting they addressed the question of track length and agreed with the advertised length of 3/8's mile. In fact, they said they took the "meter" out and walked "the line" and it was close enough to 3/8's to call it 3/8's... I'll be interested to see what Graham says. Considering this information - you would recalculate the HMS speed to: HMS, 13.827, Eddy Wallace, 5/24/03 = 97.64 MPH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbac Posted August 25, 2003 Report Share Posted August 25, 2003 my son had a radar at sas for the romco race, he said donnie wilson was fastest at 108 on the back stretch. dont know how accurate the gun is, but it seemed a little slow to me. bubba c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierDaddy Posted August 25, 2003 Report Share Posted August 25, 2003 Seems like at SAS, romco would be hitting about 120 at the end of the straightaways. Thats what it seems like from the stands anyway. But when Brandon came back to texas at the end of 2000, right before Oktoberfast, we went out there with them and watched em practice from down in the pits and it sure seems alot slower from in the pits then it does in the stands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bandit Posted August 25, 2003 Report Share Posted August 25, 2003 Nick, calculate the gear ratio/tire size/rpm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HORSEPOWER Posted August 26, 2003 Report Share Posted August 26, 2003 Super late models at Five Flags (.5 mile) run low 16's, I-70 (.543) high 16's, and at Bristol (.533) in All Pro Series last year 15.9 with restictor plates, Dick Anderson has record of 15.532/123.5 mph, NASCAR record is 14.9/128 mph, I know they have diff set of rules and specs, but banking on the straights sure makes a difference. I went to the World Cup at I-70 in 2001, and these cars were flying. I think the pay out is $10,000 to the winner, but is same date as October fast, sure would like to see some locals in that event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racerpete2 Posted August 26, 2003 Report Share Posted August 26, 2003 Just my guess but I think that TMS is the fastest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonestar88 Posted August 26, 2003 Report Share Posted August 26, 2003 Bandit, We have a slide rule at the shop that calculates the same way and it shows to be faster than the speeds posted here. gear ratio/ tire size/ rpm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted August 27, 2003 Report Share Posted August 27, 2003 Lonestar88, That's because gear ratio charts and calculators are looking at terminal velocity, not average speed. In other words, you gear for the speed you hope to achieve at the end of the straight, not the average speed around the whole track. Nick Holt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bandit Posted August 27, 2003 Report Share Posted August 27, 2003 Are we looking for average or terminal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted August 27, 2003 Report Share Posted August 27, 2003 Bandit, The thread started out talking about the average speed, rather than top (or terminal) speed. Either way, SAS is the fastest of the four tracks originally discussed in this thread. Nick Holt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonestar88 Posted August 27, 2003 Report Share Posted August 27, 2003 Nick, You are correct, the thread is about average speed, thanks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierDaddy Posted August 28, 2003 Report Share Posted August 28, 2003 Man, I didnt know All Pro had to run restrictor plates at bristol. If they ran 15.9 with the plate, just imagine how fast they would be without it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bandit Posted August 28, 2003 Report Share Posted August 28, 2003 I was told by a friend that formerly worked for a Cup team that a Super Late Model is .8 to 1.5 seconds faster than a Cup car on a half mile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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