Cars Tour

[24nomo]

June Bug, Jeff Burton, Kevin Harvick and Justin Marks bought the CARS tour.   Things are looking good in Late Model Asphalt racing.  They are not requiring used Junk $30 tires.  You can buy brand new Hoosiers and let the Show begin

[ron.brown11]

That's great news. We need more racers running some of these touring series'. I think Larson will do well with his dirt series. The Whelen Modified series is strong and expanding. The west coast SRL series is going strong, and they've expanded their national series to nearly double what it was last season. I'm really hoping that HMP can get some stability, because that's just too beautiful of a facility to see it go away. Plus, that would give the CARS series a place to race in TX. 

But I'm still hoping for a progressive banked 3/8 asphalt track at COTA. That's probably just pissing in the wind, but I can hope, right?

[RodneyRodriguez]

Don't change the model, don't think this group will. It's become the current day All Pro Series for a reason. They will grow this well I think and I expect to see some expansion but all of these folks (minus Marks) understand the plight of a short track racer. They will do well while letting the SLM series do what they do.

 

Lets see if in typical racing fashoin the SLM teams don't try to migrate to CARS, lots of great talent young and old in this series.

[MikePeters95]

15 hours ago, ron.brown11 said:

progressive banked 3/8 asphalt track at COTA. That's probably just pissing in the wind, but I can hope, right?

You're hope is in the right place, but also at the wrong place.  TMS needs to be your hope.  I am trying to sell them on the front straight for a Clash/Bowman Gray type race, but they're watching HMP to evaluate what to do with the land doing nothing outside of turn 3.  They are aware of a smaller multi-purpose facility bringing value and community to the track.

Really hoping a mini Iowa layout (banking wise) with the TMS/Speedway dogleg with an Irwindale like paved infield is something viable, as that would be an actual useful venue, which is what they're looking for.

Which is why even if you don't like the current promoter or whatever as some of you have been very vocal about, support HMP.  Other venues are watching.

I'm still hoping something is actually done at Revolution Park.  That place, is, literally, ready to go.

[24nomo]

All that we need is for HMP to bring John M back.  He had that place rocking because that is how he made his living.

[ron.brown11]

Mike, I'd be good with TMS, it would probably limit the number of times a season that I'd be able to go. If they made it like the LA Coliseum or Bowman Gray, I wouldn't go at all. I'm not interested in dump and run racing, or demo derbies on the front stretch. But I know this, we need asphalt racing alive & well in TX. I have 2 reasons why I like the COTA location. First, I'm greedy, as it's closer to where I live. The second is because of that location. It's a reasonable drive from the DFW area, the Houston area, and SA area. What is that, like 20 million people? I live north of Austin, and that makes TMS a little over 200 miles away. That makes SA & Houston about 300 miles away. How many racers/fans can do that on a regular basis? 

It's approximately 155 miles from Houston to COTA. It's approximately 240 from TMS, and it's about 90 from SA. Of course these all all just Goggle maps numbers from the downtown areas of SA & Houston, and I used the actual address of TMS to COTA. I think that you would pull more racers & fans from OK, if the short track is at TMS. I'm not sure having more OK racers & fans at TMS is all that helpful for TX. But I'd be happy to have a good asphalt short track here in TX. I just feel that we'd have a better chance at cultivating more TX asphalt racers, if the track is in a more central location, to where TX asphalt racing used to flourish. I have no trouble being wrong about that, because I really want TX asphalt racing to come back. 

[RodneyRodriguez]

I've talked to folks at COTA and mentioned a short track. Don't think we want that they don't get what we do it would be few that could afford to race there. They only know big racing they would not sell $30 pit passes and big purses, TMS may get get it but again for the people around here that will be too far and lodging isn't cheap. Bottom line Texans need to put your eggs in the Houston basket I cannot think of anyone that is to build a SAS, THR, Pan Am, CC Speedway etc. There's one hang your hat on that. 

[24nomo]

HMS is the perfect spot for it here in Texas.  Large Corp base to pull sponsorship from.  The Oil guys have money to burn right now.    If they would bring late model racing there, people would pay attention.    I doubt with the current lineup they will get the attention needed to attract Corp sponsorship like was there before when they had a great class of Late Models.

[ron.brown11]

I'm going to show my ignorance here, but where is Revolution Park located??

[RodneyRodriguez]

Monroe, Louisiana. 

 

Edited January 13, 2023 by RodneyRodriguez

[arob]

I don't know any of the history of Big H Speedway other than they had a huge car count. So why was it converted from dirt to asphalt? Was Big H losing car count? Just curious.

[ron.brown11]

Thanks Rodney. I googled Revolution Park and that's what I found. I thought surely I must have this wrong, because that's even farther away than any of the TX locations that were being discussed. If I was going to drive that far, I'd just go to Five Flags. I truly can't see where either of those 2 (Revolution Park & Five Flags) would help TX asphalt racing. Unless there was a track in TX, that they could say alternate race dates, it doesn't make sense.

Racing is way too expensive as it is. If teams or fans have to drive 300-400 miles each way for a race, it had better be a big name race with a huge purse, to be able to draw big name racers. And you can't do that every week. Heck, I seriously doubt you could get big crowds of cars or fans if done only once a month. I know as Texans, we are used to driving a lot just to get groceries, but with the price of groceries, and everything else, what will they have to give up just to be able to afford to go to these races (whether racers or fans)? And then again, I still come back to the same question. How will this help develop asphalt racing in TX?

If there can't be a new track built in TX, HMP is the only egg in the basket. If a new track can be built, serious questions will need to be considered up front. Where can it draw cars from? Where can it draw fans from? Is it a reasonable enough distance, that both can afford to get there on a regular basis? Can it afford to pay enough in purses, to get teams to dig out those parked race cars, and get them ready to race? Can it afford to lose money for at least 2 seasons, to build up the fan base and car count? Is there enough businesses in the region to support race teams & the track? 

This is why I really think that COTA could be the solution. There are a lot of racers that have run CTS, SAS & HMP, that aren't currently racing, or are racing only on a limited basis. TMS would be a long haul for those that race out of Houston or the Corpus areas, which has the most recent active racers. Austin & SA have some, and it's not as long of a haul. As Mike said above, TMS is looking into doing something there for asphalt racers, and seem to value having a multi-use facility. But it's also obvious that SMI has at least a good working relationship with the owners at COTA. And the owners at COTA already have a lot of other activities going there, so they have a lot of supporting multi-use activities in place. I don't know what all TMS has in place, and maybe Mike can fill us in on that. COTA also has the acreage to build a decent sized track. With that location, it should be able to draw racers & fans from DFW, Houston, SA, & Corpus. Plus there is a lot of industry in those areas, to try and get funding for teams & the track. So that's also approximately 20 million people to try and entice to come to watch, and or become racers. But I think that COTA has something that TMS doesn't have. Austin has always been a destination location in TX. I cannot tell you why that is, but according to several sources, people love to come to Austin. I also cannot tell you if those same people that are attracted to coming to Austin, are racers or race fans. But people are coming here. I'm betting the folks at TMS have noticed that too. If not, would they have been as willing to make less money hosting races at COTA vs TMS? I realize the TMS knew that they were likely to lose 1 Cup date at TMS, but didn't have to partner with COTA. I don't know what the answer is, but I'm certain that if the right people, with the right motivations, put their minds (and finances) to it, there is a solution to save asphalt racing in TX. Then it will be up to all involved to support it. That there might be the biggest unknown. Will we support it??

[Josh42]

On 1/13/2023 at 2:28 PM, ron.brown11 said:

Thanks Rodney. I googled Revolution Park and that's what I found. I thought surely I must have this wrong, because that's even farther away than any of the TX locations that were being discussed. If I was going to drive that far, I'd just go to Five Flags. I truly can't see where either of those 2 (Revolution Park & Five Flags) would help TX asphalt racing. Unless there was a track in TX, that they could say alternate race dates, it doesn't make sense.

Racing is way too expensive as it is. If teams or fans have to drive 300-400 miles each way for a race, it had better be a big name race with a huge purse, to be able to draw big name racers. And you can't do that every week. Heck, I seriously doubt you could get big crowds of cars or fans if done only once a month. I know as Texans, we are used to driving a lot just to get groceries, but with the price of groceries, and everything else, what will they have to give up just to be able to afford to go to these races (whether racers or fans)? And then again, I still come back to the same question. How will this help develop asphalt racing in TX?

If there can't be a new track built in TX, HMP is the only egg in the basket. If a new track can be built, serious questions will need to be considered up front. Where can it draw cars from? Where can it draw fans from? Is it a reasonable enough distance, that both can afford to get there on a regular basis? Can it afford to pay enough in purses, to get teams to dig out those parked race cars, and get them ready to race? Can it afford to lose money for at least 2 seasons, to build up the fan base and car count? Is there enough businesses in the region to support race teams & the track? 

This is why I really think that COTA could be the solution. There are a lot of racers that have run CTS, SAS & HMP, that aren't currently racing, or are racing only on a limited basis. TMS would be a long haul for those that race out of Houston or the Corpus areas, which has the most recent active racers. Austin & SA have some, and it's not as long of a haul. As Mike said above, TMS is looking into doing something there for asphalt racers, and seem to value having a multi-use facility. But it's also obvious that SMI has at least a good working relationship with the owners at COTA. And the owners at COTA already have a lot of other activities going there, so they have a lot of supporting multi-use activities in place. I don't know what all TMS has in place, and maybe Mike can fill us in on that. COTA also has the acreage to build a decent sized track. With that location, it should be able to draw racers & fans from DFW, Houston, SA, & Corpus. Plus there is a lot of industry in those areas, to try and get funding for teams & the track. So that's also approximately 20 million people to try and entice to come to watch, and or become racers. But I think that COTA has something that TMS doesn't have. Austin has always been a destination location in TX. I cannot tell you why that is, but according to several sources, people love to come to Austin. I also cannot tell you if those same people that are attracted to coming to Austin, are racers or race fans. But people are coming here. I'm betting the folks at TMS have noticed that too. If not, would they have been as willing to make less money hosting races at COTA vs TMS? I realize the TMS knew that they were likely to lose 1 Cup date at TMS, but didn't have to partner with COTA. I don't know what the answer is, but I'm certain that if the right people, with the right motivations, put their minds (and finances) to it, there is a solution to save asphalt racing in TX. Then it will be up to all involved to support it. That there might be the biggest unknown. Will we support it??

Cota wont build a short track for local racers or even travel racers.  They only want the big events or the SCCA, Porsche, Ferrari days. They don't care about the local racer.  Yes Austin is a travel destination but those people traveling to Austin aren't coming to Austin to go see a Saturday night short track. 

When it comes to Asphalt racing in Texas, its a thing of the past and HMP is holding on barely in my eyes. They have tried to get the late model racing going, they tried and big money race at Houston hoping to pull cars from 5 flags and Monroe and only like 3 came. Back in the hey day of Asphalt racing in Texas CTS, SAS drivers would travel to Houston to race but the racers in Houston would not reciprocate and travel to CTS or SAS. I know the tracks made common rules and raced on weekends apart so people could travel. CTS would have a race and have 10 trucks, HMP would have one and have 20+ trucks. The Super Stock class Central Texas racers would travel and Houston racers wouldnt.  You did have a small group of houston racers that would but not very many. 

So in closing as much as you want another asphalt track in Texas support the tracks that are open, I know they are dirt but they have car counts and are thriving.  

[24nomo]

You pretty much hit it on the head Josh.   As much as I hate to say it, that racer at Kyle pretty much ruined it for asphalt racing in Texas and I dont blame the track owners.   Heck, Texas dont even support TMS.  So get used to traveling if you want to see it in person.  But I would just assume watch it on TV and Racing America is cheap.   I wish Race on Texas would get right on their prices

[RodneyRodriguez]

Love the COTA idea for sure, hell it's close to me. Don't think it's so much that they don't care about the local stuff but more of a situation where something would need to be presented to them that would produce a profit or the possibility of profit which we know how that goes. I think a race track there where they could do the Bristol thing with both surfaces could be more of an idea with big shows coming in and supplementing with some of the other divisions around. Some WOO, Late Models, IMCA events and pavement shows could be interesting. Plenty of room for camping etc the way the place is designed. 

They would for sure need the push from outside the state of Texas though to make it event worthy, Austin is indeed a destination for NASCAR and F1 fans but don't think any of those reasons entice short track fans whatsoever hell lots of short track fans don't even want to drive on Austin roads.

 

I've always thought Retama would be a better option.

 

Edited January 16, 2023 by RodneyRodriguez

[MikePeters95]

I think anyone with a pipe dream that the only purpose-built Formula One track in the United States, would even entertain a short track, shows that they've never been to COTA and really don't understand COTA's business model at all.

To put it in perspective, the rentals there start at about $50,000.  There is no ROI model for a short track there at the level they would have to build it without devaluing their F1 track, and they know it.  If someone wants to build Lanier Raceplex across the street from it on their own dime, similar to how Road Atlanta/Lanier are, sure.

TMS knows building a short track would lose money, but they're open to the Clash/Bowman grey thing to see if cars would even show up to then evaluate a multipurpose Irwindale like multipurpose short track....if anyone shows interest.  I think you guys as a community have made it clear you wouldn't so thanks for speaking up.  They know a multipurpose venue they could rent out 200+ days a year like Irwindale would work, for film, commercials, safety school, drifting, autocross, racing, etc.   They're watching HMP, and the last race really didn't put any wind in any sails.

For someone in Austin/San Antonio/Corpus to build / rebuild a facility, they're going to need car count, and similar to the dirt tracks, they're going to need to pull and share some car count from communities.  I'm pretty sure the Venn Diagram for I37, South Texas Race Ranch, etc, have a lot of overlap, and the pavement community needs to rebuild and grow those circles so the tracks can survive somewhat.

If you can support the Monroe track at all I think it's a great choice.  This forum is supposed to represent the entire state, so for the North and East Texas folks, Monroe isn't too far at all, and the owner is an excellent guy that really wants to see his track re-open, and it's his passion project funded by his other many successful endeavors. 

Edited January 16, 2023 by MikePeters95