RodneyRodriguez Posted November 16, 2022 Report Posted November 16, 2022 Well we are winding down another season. Let's reflect and highlight some positives, I'll start: ~I love seeing South Texas race tracks working hand in hand to build better car counts and deliver the best shows for their customers. ~ Lots of classes/divisions are thriving I hope rule makers are able to keep this trend. ~ There is still hope for pavement racing in Texas, I think this seems to be on track to keep it rolling. ~ LSSZ is still thriving, let's all continue to push people here. Quote
rails Posted November 18, 2022 Report Posted November 18, 2022 (edited) I am curious to see what they are going to do with TMS after this year. In the lower grandstands they took out every other row and put in a table ledge to set drinks and stuff on. I could still swing a cat in any direction and not hit a soul from my seats. Not sure how long it is going to be able to hang on that way. I know there has been talk of some sort of reconfiguration. But my gut tells me that date could end back up at North Wilksboro. I hope not, but the way the place was managed from a fans perspective at this years fall race it my be better if it goes away. Hopefully HMP will be back to a full race season next year. I was able to make the Sept race and it made me happy to be back there and see a really nice crowd. Now I hope to be able to make it down to Corpus for the 3 day show in December. Just need some luck to go my way. Edited November 18, 2022 by rails Quote
HiTech Posted November 18, 2022 Report Posted November 18, 2022 4 minutes ago, rails said: I am curious to see what they are going to do with TMS after this year. In the lower grandstands they took out every other row and put in a table ledge to set drinks and stuff on. I could still swing a cat in any direction and not hit a soul from my seats. Not sure how long it is going to be able to hang on that way. I know there has been talk of some sort of reconfiguration. But my gut tells me that date could end back up at North Wilksboro. I hope not, but the way the place was managed from a fans perspective at this years fall race it my be better if it goes away. Hopefully HMP will be back to a full race season next year. I was able to make the Sept race and it made me happy to be back there and see a really nice crowd. Now I hope to be able to make it down to Corpus for the 3 day show in December. Just need some luck to go my way. ILL WISH YOU THE LUCK .. Quote
HiTech Posted November 18, 2022 Report Posted November 18, 2022 DONT u just hate it ..u spent your teen years that seemed to last forever trying to hit 18 least in my time so you can go party buy beer vote and get that dreaded draft card . then life real life hits u in the bud .you get married going on nearly forty years with the wife .. your son is 31 and getting married your bones hurt you find yourself forgetting where the keys to your truck are when they are right in your left hand . somone is screaming get out of the way grandpa you are to slow while showing u the all american you are number one hand signal no left or right turn on that one no mistake on the meaning . u worry about what tomorrow will bring you, find ten minute jobs turns into an hour or more . you look at the youths of today thinking wow they are crazy wild misfits this countries future is headed towards hell ..yet never realizing the old said the same thing when u were young .. it seems garbage day is every two days when its 7 ..... u looked forward with excitment for dec 25 th now wondering what am i going to buy my family my wife so the easy way out is a gift card .. adds all over the place and pop ups on your phone every second of the day drive u nuts . when sears roebuck catalog was then the most exciting thing to come around at christmas and christmas holiday started in december not september .. mowing yards back then for 2 bucks pulling that tiny little no horse power motored contraption behind your bike with tiny little wheels that never seemed to follow your forward motion we needed nicks chassis class back then and in time swinging a yo yo to cut high grass down .. because the tiny little movwer had no horse power all that hard work to finally save $300 bucks to buy your first car after two years worth of mowing ..an old 62ford falcon with springs poking your behind through the cotton seats one burned out cylinder the first five cylinder u ever owned .wipers didint work headliner flapping in the no air conditioned two 70mph windows down ac , all the good old days that old car made me proud .now the young kids today have to own a spic an span shining new truck to keep up with the joneses ..hell the best car i owned was that old falcon i paid for it with blood sweat an tears . an had tears when it got wrecked . meaning i now had to walk again .......................but the best thing now is i and u are still alive to tell about it . 2023 NEVER GAVE IT A THOUGHT I WOULD SEE THAT ...IF i make it that far .but again its only going to feel like two days away . garbage day again Quote
MikePeters95 Posted November 29, 2022 Report Posted November 29, 2022 On 11/17/2022 at 10:34 PM, rails said: I am curious to see what they are going to do with TMS after this year. In the lower grandstands they took out every other row and put in a table ledge to set drinks and stuff on. I could still swing a cat in any direction and not hit a soul from my seats. Not sure how long it is going to be able to hang on that way. I know there has been talk of some sort of reconfiguration. But my gut tells me that date could end back up at North Wilksboro. There is some fresh blood at TMS that is very open to a lot of things, and very self-critical. I think it's imperative that we try to support tracks that we can including TMS. I do have a dialogue going with them and they are glad asphalt racing is on an upswing and we have a meeting scheduled early Q1 next year, they're taking a hard look at some land not being used outside turn 3 and doing evaluations on building a short track, or using the flat track on the front straight. TMS is doing fine. The facility is rented out over 200 days a year for all kinds of things. I really hope in 2-3 years we see HMP, TMS, Revolution Park and the bullring at JRP Speedway in Oklahoma hosting racing, drifting, car meets and anything they can to monetize the pavement they have sustainably. Be nice to have a little touring series at those facilities, which I know for a fact is a possibility. Separate conversation, I hope a true entry level class such as street/super stock is figured out for pavement. Some folks don't want to race Cavaliers, and also don't have 1k to spend on consumables every race. Be nice to see a 300 treadwear Crown Vic or some other cheap class actually happen. If anyone finds this post critical that's fine, I'll be there supporting these things any way I can afford monetarily and chronologically. These are all things that can happen if action is actually taken. Quote
rails Posted November 29, 2022 Report Posted November 29, 2022 6 hours ago, MikePeters95 said: There is some fresh blood at TMS that is very open to a lot of things, and very self-critical. I think it's imperative that we try to support tracks that we can including TMS. I do have a dialogue going with them and they are glad asphalt racing is on an upswing and we have a meeting scheduled early Q1 next year, they're taking a hard look at some land not being used outside turn 3 and doing evaluations on building a short track, or using the flat track on the front straight. TMS is doing fine. The facility is rented out over 200 days a year for all kinds of things. I really hope in 2-3 years we see HMP, TMS, Revolution Park and the bullring at JRP Speedway in Oklahoma hosting racing, drifting, car meets and anything they can to monetize the pavement they have sustainably. Be nice to have a little touring series at those facilities, which I know for a fact is a possibility. Separate conversation, I hope a true entry level class such as street/super stock is figured out for pavement. Some folks don't want to race Cavaliers, and also don't have 1k to spend on consumables every race. Be nice to see a 300 treadwear Crown Vic or some other cheap class actually happen. If anyone finds this post critical that's fine, I'll be there supporting these things any way I can afford monetarily and chronologically. These are all things that can happen if action is actually taken. We can probably agree to disagree on this one. TMS may be rented out for some wedding or other function 200 days a year. But it is a motorsports facility first. And they don’t do very well in that arena. From the racing, to how they take care of there fans, they fail miserably right now. They have been at it since 1997, they don’t control a lot of the racing aspect, but the fan treatment they do. And they fail, if they want to know how to put on a weekend events as it pertains to your paying customers they should go spend a weekend at Talladega to see how it is done properly. There is no excuse, and there is no defending it. And I let them know about it in there fan survey post race. I wish nothing but success for HMP and this new series. I was able to make the first race but not these last 2. But will be there when I can. Quote
MikePeters95 Posted November 29, 2022 Report Posted November 29, 2022 As someone who works at that facility probably 20+ days a year, I assure you it's not for weddings, mostly OEM rentals for product demonstrations on the road course, and a plethora of other things. The problem, as demonstrated in this exact thread, is people seemingly want to be upset about something and don't go to the races. Thankfully SMI, who is owned by the same people that own a lot of companies and have diversified very well, use a lot of their business relationships, and OEM / Auto industry relationships to keep that place busy. A properly ran facility doesn't make the money on the less than 10 days annually they host races, they figure out how to generate revenue as many days as they can over a 365 day period. I am glad to see that new management has revamped some of their nonsense and disconnected cooler policies and other things done by people who were too burned out, antiquated and stuck in their ways and are not creating barriers to participation in a sporting event segment that is one of the few that is not offering climate controlled environments, in one of the longest events you can go to as well. This isn't 1997 where most of your potential customers (race fans) work outside, do physical labor, and only have climate control in their home, maybe their vehicle anymore. For a track with the second largest attendance of a NASCAR race ever (216k, second only to the Brickyard), they've done a great job diversifying their day to day operations so they can sustain without racing, and they did that to keep the racing going. Quote
RodneyRodriguez Posted November 29, 2022 Author Report Posted November 29, 2022 Great points Mike, I can tell you that is a big part of what has made COTA begin to reach it's potential. Ricky Brooks invited me out to the Trans Am event in November and being there in a not so crowded time I walked the place and had no idea of all the other non racing things there. Quote
MikePeters95 Posted November 30, 2022 Report Posted November 30, 2022 Once you get on the backside of how some these places operate, it's super cool. They actually bring in temporary HVAC to the garages at TMS and turn them into exhibition halls for mini-trade shows with several large vendors, it's pretty cool. I know COTA does some similar stuff as well and tries to keep the place busy with folks coming and going, which ultimately helps us out with the 5% of people who've never been to a racetrack, go there for some work-related function, then come back and get into motorsports. Quote
rails Posted November 30, 2022 Report Posted November 30, 2022 11 hours ago, MikePeters95 said: As someone who works at that facility probably 20+ days a year, I assure you it's not for weddings, mostly OEM rentals for product demonstrations on the road course, and a plethora of other things. The problem, as demonstrated in this exact thread, is people seemingly want to be upset about something and don't go to the races. Thankfully SMI, who is owned by the same people that own a lot of companies and have diversified very well, use a lot of their business relationships, and OEM / Auto industry relationships to keep that place busy. A properly ran facility doesn't make the money on the less than 10 days annually they host races, they figure out how to generate revenue as many days as they can over a 365 day period. I am glad to see that new management has revamped some of their nonsense and disconnected cooler policies and other things done by people who were too burned out, antiquated and stuck in their ways and are not creating barriers to participation in a sporting event segment that is one of the few that is not offering climate controlled environments, in one of the longest events you can go to as well. This isn't 1997 where most of your potential customers (race fans) work outside, do physical labor, and only have climate control in their home, maybe their vehicle anymore. For a track with the second largest attendance of a NASCAR race ever (216k, second only to the Brickyard), they've done a great job diversifying their day to day operations so they can sustain without racing, and they did that to keep the racing going. I not only go to the races, but I spend a considerable amount of money doing so. It is important to excel at the basics on race weekend. TMS fails in that aspect. Its great to hear that they have other revenue streams. I go there for the fall race weekend. Getting the tanks pumped in your motorhome should be easy, its not. Buying a bag of ice on the grounds when it is a 100 degrees for 4 days should be easy, its not. I understand its not 1997 anymore, but when you have been doing something since 1997, you should have the basics sorted out. TMS does not. The opener at HMP for the new series ran out of a lot of stuff at the concessions stand, you expect that, they will figure it out and get it sorted out. There is no defending TMS these days for me. Its not called the Texas Convention Center, it is Texas Motor Speedway. Quote
HiTech Posted November 30, 2022 Report Posted November 30, 2022 2 hours ago, rails said: I not only go to the races, but I spend a considerable amount of money doing so. It is important to excel at the basics on race weekend. TMS fails in that aspect. Its great to hear that they have other revenue streams. I go there for the fall race weekend. Getting the tanks pumped in your motorhome should be easy, its not. Buying a bag of ice on the grounds when it is a 100 degrees for 4 days should be easy, its not. I understand its not 1997 anymore, but when you have been doing something since 1997, you should have the basics sorted out. TMS does not. The opener at HMP for the new series ran out of a lot of stuff at the concessions stand, you expect that, they will figure it out and get it sorted out. There is no defending TMS these days for me. Its not called the Texas Convention Center, it is Texas Motor Speedway. WOW 1997 FIRST NASCAR race we went to .. went to the bush race where it rained and rained and stayed in a mall for hours nad hour waiting for the race to restart ..and we loved it cool seeing the race finish at night .. sunday we had to park three miles past the track we paid 20 bucks a car to park on a ranch .. the all 10 of us with ice chest blankets and many other items walk those three miles .. got there just as the cars were rolling off pit road .. after the race we crossed over the freeway . as a truck was baout to pass us up i stuck my thumb up the truck stopped we loaded up the driver took us to our cars .. we sent the next five years taking ten of us to the track .. we always paid for 12 seats .ice chest and itens needed a place to sit too ... have not been back to a nascar race sense 2002 .. rained us out that day and we had ot come back seeing i owned a fed ex gorund route with no one to cover my route .. a $1000 bucks wasted .. did go one years to an irl race .. Quote
Josh42 Posted November 30, 2022 Report Posted November 30, 2022 On 11/29/2022 at 12:48 AM, MikePeters95 said: The bullring at JRP Speedway in Oklahoma hosting racing, Mike just asking do you have any more information on this facility? I literally work about a 1.5 mile from this track, they have the go cart track there that does get used regularly. I've asked a lot of people that I have met since moving up here about that track and everyone says it never really took off. But other than that I cant get really any other info on it. Quote
MikePeters95 Posted November 30, 2022 Report Posted November 30, 2022 34 minutes ago, Josh42 said: Mike just asking do you have any more information on this facility? I literally work about a 1.5 mile from this track, they have the go cart track there that does get used regularly. I've asked a lot of people that I have met since moving up here about that track and everyone says it never really took off. But other than that I cant get really any other info on it. That's consistent with what I've heard. Apparently they do drift events on the oval there now ( A lot of "Dormant" ovals host drifting now since the crowd is just happy to have somewhere to run and doesn't bring drama or bash facility owners, a phenomenon I will never in my life understand). Once of my drifting buddies got me in touch with the owner who ( and to his credit, he is right) would love to see his track host anything, but doesn't have the time, resources, network to get routine racing there on the asphalt track, says hes tried a few times and it's just not worth the hassle, however he stated if someone got a series together he would absolutely love for it to stop by and was very up front that his track is a smaller bullring but they've ran late models and such there. I found some youtube videos from I think 2013ish of some late models, street stocks and eco stocks running there. The drifting guys said the pavement isn't broken up or anything and you can run apron to wall no problem there. The facility mainly operates the karting track and the owner is on cruise control enjoying life and having his track as his retirement fun. I think a series stopping by with the right expectations could operate great with this as a bullring stop. As we all know, right now in the area, we need anything if we want any variety. I just wish there was something for the Austin/SA crowd that was workable in any way. All I could find was this place, TMS, Revolution Park in Monroe LA and HMP, which are great facilities, I just know there are a lot of you guys over that way and wish you could have a home track that wasn't several hours away. Altus speedway is up there but from what I understand it's for sale and the state of the facility is unclear. Quote
Josh42 Posted November 30, 2022 Report Posted November 30, 2022 13 minutes ago, MikePeters95 said: Revolution Park in Monroe LA You might check but I know this track has dirt put on top of the asphalt or it was tore up. But the World of Outlaws either ran there this year or last but after that the track was being shut down. Quote
MikePeters95 Posted November 30, 2022 Report Posted November 30, 2022 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Josh42 said: You might check but I know this track has dirt put on top of the asphalt or it was tore up. But the World of Outlaws either ran there this year or last but after that the track was being shut down. The lease with the dirt promoter ended, the dirt has been removed, and the owner of that place would really like to see racing back. For those of you not familiar, this is an incredibly nice facility in Monroe, Louisiana. Here are some older videos. And here is the track in Tulsa The drifting video was a couple months ago. These are tracks with willing, and eager owners that know they are not a promoter, that would be happy to host a stop on some sort of series/tour. Very low hanging fruit to help the slow process of rebuilding this region on asphalt. Edited November 30, 2022 by MikePeters95 Quote
Josh42 Posted November 30, 2022 Report Posted November 30, 2022 That place is a super nice facility. Quote
24nomo Posted December 1, 2022 Report Posted December 1, 2022 On 11/29/2022 at 7:35 PM, rails said: I not only go to the races, but I spend a considerable amount of money doing so. It is important to excel at the basics on race weekend. TMS fails in that aspect. Its great to hear that they have other revenue streams. I go there for the fall race weekend. Getting the tanks pumped in your motorhome should be easy, its not. Buying a bag of ice on the grounds when it is a 100 degrees for 4 days should be easy, its not. I understand its not 1997 anymore, but when you have been doing something since 1997, you should have the basics sorted out. TMS does not. The opener at HMP for the new series ran out of a lot of stuff at the concessions stand, you expect that, they will figure it out and get it sorted out. There is no defending TMS these days for me. Its not called the Texas Convention Center, it is Texas Motor Speedway. I have been going for years. Camping is an option and I enjoy the roughing it part of getting ice, getting the tanks pumped etc. I do not expect TMS to do the work. I have never had a problem getting ice, I mean there is a Buccees right there now. LOL If I have to pull up and go pump my own tank out, so be it. That is part of the experience. [edited out by Nick Holt, 12/12/2022] Quote
rails Posted December 2, 2022 Report Posted December 2, 2022 Typically a good management system puts the service in place that at the very least they are either driving through the campgrounds, or easily a phone call away. And I don't particularly care to leave the grounds in a vehicle after I have been drinking. [Edited out by Nick Holt, 12/2/2022] Quote
NickHolt Posted December 2, 2022 Report Posted December 2, 2022 OK, folks. Enough of the bickering with each other. FB is the place for that, not Lone Star Speedzone. I have edited from where the personal stuff first started, so please don't get all defensive about defending any comments I deleted. Thanks NIck Quote
ron.brown11 Posted December 2, 2022 Report Posted December 2, 2022 Rodney, I still think a progressive banked 3/8 mile track (behind the back stretch) at COTA could be a winner. I'm sure the COTA would love to have another revenue stream too. If they would/could have uniform rules, and coordinate race dates, COTA, HMP, Mobile & Five Flags could have a great touring series. They could create their own points championships, and have a separate touring championship too. ARCA has done it with the East, West & National series' operating their own championships. Then they have crossover races, and because ARCA races big tracks, they also have a short track series championship. Mike, I've been to the Altus Speedway many times, but that was when I either lived in Altus or was up at Sheppard AFB for business. I'm certain that the guy (Bob Speer), that built and operated the track isn't still alive. He was already in his mid/late 60s the last time I was there, and that was in the mid-late 80s. I don't know if the family runs it or if it was sold off. He had a clean, well run facility. However the track was just 1/3 miles, and it was a bit tight. The best track in Altus was almost straight across the highway (US 283) from Altus Speedway. It was less than 1/2 mile away, literally across the highway. Tell me that was a good business plan! The last name I heard it was Sooner International Speedway. It was a beautiful 1/2 mile asphalt, with a slight d shape on the front stretch, and a small dirt track on the side. The guy who built it (Garland Waldroop), had talked with the man that owned/operated (Speer) Altus Speedway. He said that he had no intentions of trying to compete with AS, and that he would run on different dates than AS. When the track was finished, Waldroop opened it on the same day that Altus had opening night, then proceeded to go head to head with AS. It didn't work, and the track closed after a year or two. Now if you've never been to Altus, OK, there is more population on Altus AFB, then in Altus! Waldroop was a racer that literally came to blows with Speer over something. I'm guessing it was either cheating or that Waldroop was out spending everybody else by a large amount. The guy must have had money though, as he spent $750k of his own money to build Sooner. Sounds a lot like Hiway 16 & Pan Am doesn't it? Oh yeah, for the 1983 season, Sooner Speedway had a guy named Mick Schuler, from San Antion as the GM. Nick & Rodney, did you know this guy? I don't know if the Sooner site has ever been bulldozed over, but you can see an overhead sat picture of the track still. I really breaks my heart that Texas, the largest CONUS state in America, doesn't have great asphalt tracks & racing series'. I have racing friends from AZ & CA, and racing friends & family in the Midwest. Even they are dumbfounded about the lack of asphalt race tracks here, and the fact that we don't have a super late model series here. Is the economy that bad here? It wasn't that long ago that racers came from around the country, to prove that they were really a racer, here in TX. I know that racing is expensive, I've done it. I know the San Antonio was really hard on equipment, but teams seemed to be back fairly quickly when something got torn up badly. Have Texans simply lost interest in asphalt racing or is there something that I'm missing? Nick & Rodney, I'd really love to hear your thoughts on this. I would love to hear anyone's thoughts on it. I started with Nick & Rodney because I think that they have a good "big picture" vantage point, where as racers tend to have a narrower point of view. For me, all are important so that I can better understand what's going on. Quote
HiTech Posted December 3, 2022 Report Posted December 3, 2022 RON back when we ran prosedans / just taking two cars upto red river speedway cost near and over 8 to 12hundred min .. our tire bill with 14 inch slicks could cost us 600 plus of that money alone .. even going to sa could and did cost 500 plus again tires alone were a big cost .. and u run for what $300 AVERAGE . JUST OUR little four bangers cost 10 to 12thousand just to keep them running with the jones ..i think in 2008 nearly if not over 20 grand to run that season ...... 1989 we had to re build our class by cutting modifcations out .. again tire cost was one big issue even then ..we had to go recaps and then later on eagle test tires ... .. . when we raced a bomber in kyle sa and cc we raced street tires cheaper and lasted longer we had an advantage there .my brother inlaw owns a tire store and he helped us pick out the best tires to run and that worked . stock motors .. so cost went way down but still not cheap .. .. now we are on dirt at first cheap .now factory stocks are running some are 10 k motors special chassis up graded control arms ball joints and such .and shocks that is the biggest shock .. 800 bucks for four min .some who can afford them go way past that mark .. the main thing here is they went to pull off slicks that cost alot less than what we were running .but that is the only savings which does not offset the rest everything else is up .. ... lucky not like asphalt racing u can take your car just about to any dirt track and not have to change much .maybe a rear gear .and some adjustin of springs . the rules are common .. ashalt racetracks were so afraid of losing cars they did not work together on common rules till its was way late ..... . ONE OF THE BIGGEST ISSUE was sponsorship it was very hard to lock heavy sponsors down ..the most normal excuse for not sponsoring us was sponsors got burned in the early years .cars not showing up and such .. . . just touching a few things that worked agaisnt asphalt racing,,,, i see alittle of it heading into dirt track racing .. mainly the cost a factory stock is not cheap .. soon to repeat past history ..on its way to killing itself .. nothing new here common issue / start a new lower class that starts the process all over .. Quote
arob Posted December 3, 2022 Report Posted December 3, 2022 Speaking as a fan that spent45 years or so watching asphalt racing and was thrilled with it. I shifted to dirt when Owen left CCS to go run STS. Been hooked on dirt ever since. I tried Kyle a few times , HMP twice and racing didn't compare to dirt.CCS dropped off after Owen left. SAS was the only asphalt track I loved and miss it to this day. Dirt gives you multi groove racing most nights , bigger car counts and better racing to this fan.Asphalt got to be get on the bottom and follow the leader. The best racing on dirt to me is Factory Stock. No matter what track you go to Factory Stock delivers. True costs have escalated in the class. I know of one car from Corpus that is a $30,000 car. And car counts have dropped a little the last couple of years. But Pure Stock counts have increased especially at 105 and the racing is good.And at the Race Ranch E-Mod seems to be a growing class. Factory Stock basically killed Street Stock it seems. I applaud HMP for their efforts and hope they succeed. Just a fan opinion here. Quote
ron.brown11 Posted December 3, 2022 Report Posted December 3, 2022 HiTech, I've been to Red River too. A lot like Altus, but not nearly as well run or maintained. I know 1st hand the costs of racing. I raced an open mod with a 650 hp engine. You needed 4 new Goodyear 8" slicks every week to have a fairly stable car ($500 a week 20 years ago). Not that a mod with that much power is ever stable, especially on 8" slicks. So the track did 2 things to try and ease the financial pain of the mod class (we were only racing for $400 a night). They went to a harder compound & after opening night, you could only buy 2 tires per night. But for opening night you could start with 8 new tires & 2 used tires. You had to manage your tires from opening day, until the end of the season, and we had a really long season. Our season started the last weekend of March, and ran until the week before Thanksgiving. We ran 22-24 times a season. The only exception to the tire rule was for extended distance races, and we could buy 4 again foe those. It helped the wallet, but it sure increased the pucker factor in an area near the wallet. Here's what the track didn't realize when they made the harder compound tire a requirement. Those harder tires were a really good field equalizer. Now spending $25k for an engine didn't matter, because the tires couldn't handle the HP. When the track started seeing high end shocks showing up on the mods, they mandated a sealed steel body, non adjustable shock. Anytime they saw something high dollar on a car, that seemed to not be directly prohibited by the rules, they'd get us together and see if most teams could afford to make the change. If most couldn't, they wrote a hard rule against it. And they enforced it too. Sure we had some drivers that won regularly, but they were also really good drivers. And, they beat you with that, not their wallet. There was a guy who ran super late models during all the years that I lived in AZ. He was in the AZ Racing Hall of Fame 15 years before he ever quit racing. He was a dirt racer, and that's what got him into the Hall. He took to asphalt like that's all he ever raced. This guy had more dirt & asphalt track championships them most drivers had wins. You can look on YouTube and see some of the races he won during the Winter Heat Series races that NASCAR promoted there in Tucson. He tried some things that weren't legal, and they parked him. He was the most popular driver at the track, and they still parked him. He never raced at Tucson Raceway Park again. Now, do you think that the other drivers in any class didn't notice? All of a sudden, cars that were winning a lot, just seemed to not be as fast. Rules work when enforced. Pretty much all the costs of racing have stayed fairly consistant over the years (when adjusted for inflation). The only big anomallies have been COVID & the supply chain issues caused by COVID (very big). Plus what has happened to our energy supply/costs in this country (almost as big). Everybody has a pretty good idea what's happening there, but I'll leave politics out of it. But this I know for certain, racers tend to be their own worst enemy, when it comes to the financial side of racing. First, we tend to choose a division that is usually over our heads talent wise and/or financially (but usually both). That right there is a mighty big hole to try and climb out from. I crew chiefed for 2 different mod teams. I bought the mod roller from the second team, at a very good price. But I had never driven a race car before. A 650hp car on 8" slicks is one helluva learning curve. By the grace of God, and a very successful super late model driver, I survived and had some success. Financially I wasn't rich, but I self funded the majority of my racing. The second big thing is that racers want better, faster, newer, shinier, fill in the blank. There's always something, that 1 thing that's going to put us in the winner's circle next race. Here's where I did a pretty good job. Every race I ever ran, was in the same car that I started in. I never had to clip it either. The trick to keeping racing costs reasonable (I can't believe I just typed that!), are the rules. Eighty percent of all the drivers is any class, don't have the money to "keep up with the Jones", 10% can afford some "better" stuff, and the last 10% have a much bigger wallet. What most promoters don't want to admit, is that they can't handle that 20%. That 20% are the ones in the comp director's, promotor or track operator's office, screaming that if they can't have/do, fill in the blank, they're not racing there anymore. So the track caves in, and the 80% fall farther behind. The track needs to understand that their show IS the 80%, and the fans would much rather see a lot of different winners, instead of 2-3 drivers winning all the races. Write strict rules that don't allow things that a street stock or 4 cylinder class doesn't need (never confuse want with need), and then enforce the rules. At the end of the day, nobody in their right mind would ever get into racing, if they don't have a lot of "disposable" cash. I've known a few that did, but most were smart enough not to want to give it a racer. Whether it's because they had been burned before, or they simply saw it as an endless money pit, I don't know. But I do know this, as I said above, we racers always want more money, speed, cars, trailers etc. AROB, I went just the opposite of you. I started out going to a very fast dirt 1/2 mile track called Tri-County Speedway. Four years later they paved it. It took me 20 years to see another dirt race, with one exception. I saw Bruce Gould win the very first World 100, at Eldora the same year that they paved Tri-County Speedway. For me, seeing Tri-County paved was an epiphany. I always hated having to watch cars having to run in the track. Then, if it was a sprint/midget race, having to wait to see them get all the cars push started. The racing I loved, it was just all that you had to watch just to get to the races. I'll watch some dirt races on FloRacing, but almost never live. By watching it later, I can fast forward to get to the races. Please don't anybody get offended, as I have said many times here before, I LOVE RACING! I just happen to love asphalt racing more, and I don't begrudge you loving dirt racing more. Quote
NickHolt Posted December 4, 2022 Report Posted December 4, 2022 When was the last time you saw a stock car parked next to a neighborhood gas station? Back in the day, almost every gas station had a beat-up stock car, or two, that ended up in the service bay weeknights and mysteriously vanished every weekend during racing season. The guys who used to pump gas, perform oil changes and turn brake drums during work hours at the corner filing station lived to race on the weekends, saving up for some potent "high test" and perhaps a used tire or two. As we all know, those days are simply a warm memory for those of us fortunate enough to have lived during that era. I personally have witnessed the gradual erosion of the foundation of the sport over the past 60+ years of active participation in the sport to the point we find ourselves today - which is not a good place. There is plenty of blame to share and we, as racers, certainly have to share a good portion of the blame. We wanted to go faster and, as we all know, speed costs money. The only question in our minds was, "How fast do we want to go?" Track owners and promoters gave in to virtually every demand we made to legalize expensive "advancements" in the sport. And now we find ourselves with almost no place to race and unable to compete with the big money teams who dominate in virtually every class. No one wants to see the same three well-heeled teams lap the field every race. In all but a very few instances (the Snowball, for example) asphalt stock car racing is all but dead and dirt track racing has learned little from the demise of the pavement scene as they continue to price themselves out of reach of many of us. I remain hopeful that stock car racing will find a way to save itself from extinction. At this point the best bet would be for the current generation of street racers to stop killing each other on the streets and start killing each other on racetracks. Quote
arob Posted December 4, 2022 Report Posted December 4, 2022 Well if the demise of the internal combustion engine and the fuel that powers it comes to pass by 2030 that would be the end of it anyway. Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.