Asphalt vs. Dirt racing

[Modracer]

I recently got back from TMS and enjoyed some very good racing at both the asphalt and dirt track. What impressed me the most was how efficient the dirt track was. The races started at 7:00 and was over by 11:30. They ran 2 heats and one feature for the Legends cars. They ran 6 heat races and 4 B-mains for the late models and one feature. This also included a 30 minute intermission. They would take 2 laps before the start of the race to introduce the drivers. Whenever one race was finished one was on the track. This was an excellent designed track as well. The entrance and exits for the race track was awesome. The star of the "show" was Ken Schrader. I guess he thought it was a Cup show instead of a dirt show. He didnt even make it out of the heat races. This after riding in the back of the pack.

[Levi]

the last time i went to TMS i went to the dirt track too

the world of outlaws was there and that was a preety good race

i thought all of the races they had that night were good and like u said as soon as one class was done there was another class on right after the last car got off the track

 

the next time i go i wanna go back to the dirt track

[Budman]

That's precisely the sort of thing that helps put butts in the seats. I've been at THR at a USAR (Romco at the time) race and it was past 11:00, and the SLM race hadn't even started yet. I've seen young families with young children get up and leave before the USAR race even started. You think they'll ever be back? Racing has to be able to compete with everything else for a family's entertainment dollar!

[NickHolt]

That's precisely the sort of thing that helps put butts in the seats.  I've been at THR at a USAR (Romco at the time) race and it was past 11:00, and the SLM race hadn't even started yet.  I've seen young families with young children get up and leave before the USAR race even started. You think they'll ever be back? Racing has to be able to compete with everything else for a family's entertainment dollar!

Anyone who attended the racing at THR last season knows that we made special efforts to finish up early. A couple of nights we were done before 10:00 p.m. And I am not pulling this from memory. We recorded the starting and finishing times for the majority of the season.

 

In 2004 ROMCO ran at THR three times.

 

March 27: We were done with the ROMCO feature at 11:15 p.m, which was too late in my opinion. I believe that's the night that Jim Lynch, Brian Callaway and I decided to keep accurate records of the start and finish times for every race.

 

July 10: We started the ROMCO feature at 9:15 and were waving the checkered at 10:05.

 

On September 25 we started the ROMCO feature at 9:12 were done at 10:04.

 

I think you must be thinking of the 2003 or 2002 THR season, Budman.

 

Nick Holt

[racerx]

The USRA race on 4/2 at SAS was over at 10:10 with trophy presentation and everything else over and done by 10:31...Terry Dickerson is adamant about ending at a reasonable time for families and Terry Barden does a great job keeping the show on schedule. I think all the tracks and series have gotten the message.

[Budman]

Nick and Racerx,

 

You are both right. Don't misunderstand me on this. I don't mean to be picking on THR specifically. Nick, you're right, the example I used was from about 3 years back. I also compliment SAS on the 4/2 race. I was there and I certainly did notice how it was run. Was out of there before 11:30.

 

This has not always been the case however, at any number of tracks I've been at. My point is, in general, it's in the best interest of any track, dirt or asphalt, for all concerned

for management to keep a handle on race night time management. As I said this has not always been the case.

 

Personally, it doesn't make that much difference. This old bas&&&d would still be sitting there at 2:00 am watching and loving it if they were still racing.

[REBELRACER]

i also agree the last couple of races at sas were very professionally run.........we left there around 10:30 both nights and didnt have to miss any of the racing..........of coarse sometimes a lot of it has to do with the amount of wrecks in the races too.........i like the new rule they have at sas about spins.........1 in the heat race and you are done, 2 in the main and you are done.........makes the race go so much quicker.............great job mr. barden and mr. dickerson...........

[oldguy]

The biggest time waster at some tracks and most aggravating is running around 10 laps under yellow because the restart lineup is that slow. It really sucks when the yellow lasts for 10 laps and everyone is in order already. When it happens 3 or 4 times in a 20 lap race it doubles the fuel cost to the racer. I have been to at least one track( HOT) where this didn't happen, at least on the nights I was there so it is possible.

No matter what the reason the track has to care to fix it. Leaving the track at 1:00AM means a long sleepy drive home. Too many classes may not be a time waster but it does make the show long.

[NickHolt]

The biggest time waster at some tracks and most aggravating is running around 10 laps under yellow because the restart lineup is that slow.  It really sucks when the yellow lasts for 10 laps and everyone is in order already.   When it happens 3 or 4 times in a 20 lap race it doubles the fuel cost to the racer.   I have been to at least one track( HOT) where this didn't happen, at least on the nights I was there so it is possible.

 No matter what the reason the track has to care to fix it.  Leaving the track at 1:00AM means a long sleepy drive home.  Too many classes may not be a time waster but it does make the show long.

oldguy,

 

I love it when someone points out a shortcoming about how a local short track show is run. Or, better yet, makes a constructive suggestion as to how it should be done. Believe me, our local race promoters and race officials read TXSZ religiously. It's like getting highly sought-after business feedback for free.

 

But let me ask you something. Are you too old to volunteer to help out with the scoring? I know that both Kathy at THR and Steve at SAS (not sure about CCMS) have invited people who have raised concerns about the scoring to come up to the booth and volunteer their scoring expertise. And if you, like me, have zero scoring expertise/experience, they will show you how it's done and invite you to have a seat.

 

I guarantee that once you've done it once or twice, you'll appreciate that it's not as easy as it looks. It's one thing to concentrate on your favorite driver or two and know exactly where they should be in the line up, but it's quite another to go back to the previous "all green flag lap" and unravel where everyone rightfully belongs, including the lapped cars.

 

Nick Holt

[KrisFrost]

Yes, scoring is hard. That is why tracks should use transponders and electronic scoring with scorers as the backup. The lineups could be determined quicker after yellows.

 

It suprised me to hear that Altus Speedway is putting in electronic scoring this year. I think they have the whole setup complete except the transponders have not arrived yet. They are making the effort to improve.

 

I don't know the costs, but that is a way to speed up lineups....

 

Kris Frost

[rebelracewriter]

I thought this was a dirt vs. asphalt racing post and I got all geared up..........and whammo!

 

Nick, oldguy may need a new prescription for his glasses to be able to help score. But whatever you do, DON'T have him weld on your rear bumper! Sorry, George, just couldn't resist.

[drv45n05]

I believe all drivers should have at least a year driving experience on dirt. It helps teach how to drive a car when the set up isn't just right. It also improves your throttle control in the turns. If you dont' believe me, then look at NASCAR and who the best drivers are right now. Most of them have dirt experience and can get the most out of a car even if the set up is off. The guys that are having the most trouble with the new tire have little to no experience on dirt. (Earnhardt, Jr. , Labonte, etc.) If you want to see how a race track should be run, go to Devil's Bowl in Mesquite. 5 Classes (2 Sprint Classes), start at 8pm and are done by 11pm. and that's with an intermission and a Trophy Dash.

[Budman]

I think dirt is the great teacher of the subtleties and nuances of car control. Those that start out on pavement may eventually "get it", I just think it takes a lot longer. With dirt, its a shorter learning curve. I'll give you an example........................ remember Tony Stewart's rookie season in nascar. They were at Talledega and Stewart tried to pass Skinner inside down the front stretch. Skinner ran them both off into the grass. Stewart dropped back and bumped Skinner in the left quarter. Skinner spent the next ten minutes wrecking. Stewart "dirt tracked it" on the grass flat all the way around turns one and two and came out on the back stretch OK. The fact that anyone could "dirt track" turns one and two at Talledega on the grass flat absolutely amazes me. Now that's car control...................JMO. What do you think?

[HORSEPOWER]

I attended the NGK Shoot-out at TMS Dirt Track, that was my first time seeing dirt track racing. The tickets were $30, but I was impressed and was worth the price. I know it was a special event, but I'm sure the weekly racing should be just as good, won't mind going to another dirt race.

 

The wrecks were not as bad as I've seen in asphalt, also if someone blows, no clean up is needed. In asphalt it takes several minutes for clean up, I know the dirt will also cover up some stuff. These are all benefactors of time, I'm sure these officials don't want to be out all night also. Scoring could be another issue and I bet they can work that out.

 

The way they steer those cars, I can see how they can gain alot of experience driving a race car.

[REBELRACER]

did biffle also race dirt at one time because he can drive the car no matter how loose it is.......he even said during his post race interview that he prefers a loose driving car, so i think this spoiler and tire deal is going to work to his advantage..........as far as dirt track racing goes, you could have saved yourself $20 and went to i-37 speedway.........the last time i went the racing was good and the show flowed smoothly so those guys over there have it down............jmo

[rebelracewriter]

budman/drv, I think driving asphalt first helped me learn how to "roll through the corners" smoother. This is essential on the tracks that get dry slick in Texas. Now "backing a car in" on a tacky track, is whole different ball game, that I still haven't gotten a good handle on.

[Budman]

Reb,

 

Amazing how red clay, under the right circumstances, can take on the same surface qualities as a polished marble floor.

[Definitive]

I haven't seen any posts about how much money you can save by breaking into this sport on the dirt.Everyone that races asphalt knows how easy it is to kill a car.The beating and banging on the dirt track makes for some ugly racecars,but they keep on rolling.

 

Hey TD...get the dirt track next to SAS open on friday nights again...start a driving school there...initiate a development program for the asphalt track...oops...there I go...thinking out loud again.

[Budman]

There you go!.................................. You've got nothing else to do with alllllllllll your spare time, and................................. Think how wealthy you'd become from it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Chris Taylor]

For whoever asked about transponders : they're a pricey lot. Each transponder is just a burger shy of $300, and they keep going up in price. You can occasionally find a "deal" on a used transponder for $250. I'm not sure what the system costs, when SCCA bought theirs AMB gave them the system with the purchase of X number of transponders. The transponder system is great when applied and used properly, it's taken the SCCA several years to get it to be worth the hassle, and even still there are problems with them being picked up by the system.

 

Of course, if you've got money to throw around, the iCard is worth every penny for the crew, or those of us who like to apply Redneck Engineering ( = Gameboy ducttaped to the dash ).

[kevin bowen]

Dirt is for soaking up oil spills and plantin taters aint it .

[fast18]

I love taters...I'm going to try dirt later when my grand stock/enduro is finished ! I love racin' !

[kevin bowen]

I tried dirt once... it tasted like dog sh#t . Think ill stick to good ol chicken mcnuggets. I hear they grow on asphalt .

[Definitive]

Oh?