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Idea for SAS and THR.


Jason

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Question does Chuck advertise for you during his radio show? Is so is it pro bono? I ask because SAS doesnt have that avenue at this time. Thats what I mean by advertising and advertising budget... I doubt you can get Trey Ware or anyone from local radio to do any consistant advertising for the track without paying for it... Catching my drift yet...I must say tho Chuckie and Debwill both do an awesome job with what they have to work with but would there be any differance if they had more to work with...

The track Owners / Promoters know what arrangements they have with media people and I doubt very much that you and I will be getting that sort of information. Does the company you work for,or just about any other privately owned business, publish that sort of business information? I doubt it. Most of us don't get to look at their books unless you own the place or work for the IRS.. LOL

 

Both Debbie Williams (SAS) and Chuck Licata (THR) have worked hard for their respective tracks this season. Much of their work was in the "name recognition" and "building relationships" area, which usually doesn't pay immediate rewards (like a 6-figure media blitz would), but is helping to establish a solid base for future growth. But it's relatively cheap. And it goes without saying that if they had more money to work with they could have purchased advertising at the various media outlets, a method which is known to be very effecitve.

 

Nick Holt

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Acually Nick most Fortune 500 companys do publish what they spend in advertising and also who does their adversting for them they usually do so in trade publications...I am pretty sure the value of having Chuck and his radio show in the area is very high and I am glad the THR family has him working for them outside of his duties at the track... It would be nice to have someone in the media business down here that would do what he does but were not that fortunate as of yet...Debbie grab a mic... lol

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Acually Nick most Fortune 500 companys do publish what they spend in advertising and also who does their adversting for them they usually do so in trade publications...I am pretty sure the value of having Chuck and his radio show in the area is very high and I am glad the THR family has him working for them outside of his duties at the track... It would be nice to have someone in the media business down here that would do what he does but were not that fortunate as of yet...Debbie grab a mic... lol

Actually, I said "privately owned", not publicly held. A BIG difference, but hey.. have it your way.

 

Nick Holt

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First thing we need between THR and SAS are common tires. We need to do it in baby steps and tires is one step.

Exactly!

 

This has been the subject of the last two TTOPA meetings and no firm decision has been reached at this point. There are going to be some upset teams no matter which way we go with the tire rules. Nevertheless, we are working on it.

 

Nick

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That would be nice. Here is a question... Would it be harder to convince the Sas guys to use 8" tires or to to give the THR guys 10". To me it would be easier to go to the 10" tires there but that should be up to the drivers...I think if they realize that if they had 10" tires they could go run SAS on nights the ROMCO cars are there ect. ect. ect... Good job Nick on everything your doing... Keep it up...

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You might recall that I sought input from the teams right here on TSZ a couple of months ago.. the results were about evenly divided with very good reasons being promoted by both sides.

 

It really looks like no matter what TTOPA decides a bunch of teams of teams are going to be hurt financially by the rules change. And we certainly have to take into consideration that there are a lot of TSRS teams that would like to race at THR and/or SAS on weekends when they are not at TSRS events. It's a tough one.

 

Nick Holt

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As a spectator, I like watching the classes with the 8" tires better. By taking some traction out of the picture, it seems bring handling & driver skill more into the picture, creating more passing oppurtunities. I know it seems that there is more passing in TSRS, and even at THR than there is at SAS. With 10" tires it seems like everybody is glued to the track and there is not much passing. The complaint I hear from friends when I take them to SAS is that the late models are just driving around like a train. These same guys like to watch THR and TSRS. Just my thoughts.

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I say forget the late models right now: Work on the classes that are closer together. Street stocks. Lets find away to get the street stocks closer together. Maybe THR should combine the street and hobby classes into one class. Then make a real bomber class that is closer to the SAS road runners and CC bombers rules. October fast proved that the THR hobby's are in a class by them selfs. Blow away a bomber but can't compete with Street stock.

 

With the parts on camaros and firebirds starting to run low in the yards when is a promoter going to step up and make an entry level front wheel drive V-6 class. That would bring in old Tauruses and Corsicas and luminas. Many of these cars you can find in the paper for under 500. Add a cage and seat and you have a real $1000 entry class. Changing over to the stock front 6 class would free up more metric cars to turn into street stocks.

 

The late models are just to far apart to bring together right now. We need to get the classes that have more cars together on the same page.

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That's funny, it's the opposite for me and the people I've taken to SAS and THR. Don't forget TSRS usually gets a high invert and can have a disparity in speed from 1-10, to where as the SAS late models are all pretty even, which make it harder to pass. I think this past year eventhough the car count wasn't high, it was one of the best racing I've seen in a long time where any of the top six or seven could have won.

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8" or 10"

If the opinion you sought is pretty much split 50-50

OK.

 

then make a dadgum decision and do it now while teams that do have to change don't have to spend money all of a sudden right before the season begins.

 

I guess what I am saying is

right,wrong or indifferent just make a decision and stick to it.

do it now.

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8" or 10"

If the opinion you sought is pretty much split 50-50

OK.

 

then make a dadgum decision and do it now while teams that do have to change don't have to spend money all of a sudden right before the season begins.

 

I guess what I am saying is

right,wrong or indifferent just make a decision and stick to it.

do it now.

All three tracks have to agree on the tire(s) -- we have been discussing this issue for several months now and are being very careful to obtain as much input as possible before making a decision. At this point the discussion is on-going.

 

Nick Holt

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I have agree with ZOOM.

 

THR-If you change to 10" tires will you gain more drivers than you lose.

SAS- If you change to 8" tires will you gain more drivers than you lose.

 

Get pride, history, and stubborness out of the way, sack up and make the call. You guys have all season to decide what you are going to do the following season. There's no sense in taking until after the first of the year to put rules out that guys have to build to in March.

 

For those who Think that I don't have a dog in this fight, well I like to go to the races even if I can't finish a racecar. I want quality races with a lot of cars to watch. Its been said a hundred times if its been said once,

You guys work together. But I know that as much as drivers want things their way, the main thing they want is consistency and to a certain degree, leadership. Tell him how to build their car and they'll do it. I hear more griping on here about the lack of coordinating the rules than I do about the individual rules. That fact should give this TTOPA some direction right there.

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WR5,

 

the lm's aren't too far apart. The first Texas Challenge race Brandon won in a TSRS car and his dad finished 2nd in a SAS LM. I think with the small changes made in weight, etc that both classes are very similar. There are rumors going around about some of these types of cars but I think these cars can all race together in the same class. NOT seperate.

 

Jason

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TTOPA is not run by anyone other than the owners/promoters of SAS, THR and CCMS. Granted, I have done a lot of the administrative work it takes to get something like this up and running, but I am by no means the person who makes the TTOPA decisions. It's the track owners and operators who make the decisions. As you can imagine, each track has to weight the pros and cons of things like deciding what tires to run, what intakes to run, what heads to run, what carb to run, etc.

 

And nobody's pretending like there will be a complete set of TTOPA rules for 2005. We are taking this one step at a time and attempting to minimize the expense involved to the teams as much as possible as we go. Right now we are looking at tires. And discussing intake systems. And working out plans for some TTOPA events at each TTOPA track next season.

 

Nick Holt

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Guest The_Greek
And working out plans for some TTOPA events at each TTOPA track next season.

 

Nick Holt

care to explain a little more about this? what type of events for next season?

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NICK,

I wasn't implying that it was your decision. I know you have been merely a moderator sort of position in this and at the most act as a representative of your track for purposes of dicussions not decisions. I also am not meaning to bash, sorry if it came out that way. What I'm saying is that for an example, the tire situation. Everyone has been talking about it for 6-8 months. I think that even the racers would just like to see a decision on it. They all have their preference, but It seems that there a lot of teams that just want to be competitive at numerous venues as their main goal. Both sides have legitimate concerns, but there is not really a legitimate reason for failing to come to some agreement on tire sizes. There seems to be only a few that are overly adamant about keeping their same tires, be they 8's or 10's.

 

Gollywiggle, Make 5 standard classes:

 

Late Model- Use SAS as Standard

Limited Late Model- use TSRS as Standard

Street Stock- cross between SAS Sportsman,CCMS Street Stock and THR Street stock

Roadrunner-Cross between CCMS Bomber and SAS Roadrunner and THR Hobby stock

Mini Stock- CCMS Thunder I believe

 

Each year meet in the off season and decide which 3 or 4 you are going to run regularly at each track. Possibly mix up the two that have been having the lowest car count to make them a biweekly or even have them rotate among the tracks. Some tracks would run the same cars every week and some would alternate some. This would create incentive to travel to other tracks and make racing over the course of the season more affordable.

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Jason the THR, TSRS style cars are the LLM I'm talking about.

Also I don't mean have both classes. I think for the time being that the True late model like San Antonio should be left by the wayside, once their is a car count and fan base rebuilt then maybe have it again.

 

Also I just reread my post, I guess I took out the part about picking one or the other. No wonder you thought that. :)

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I'm saying that they can run with the LM's.

No reason to keep spreading cars thinner with multiple classes.

 

Late Model's - SAS LM's and THR/TSRS LM's

Street Stocks - SAS Sportsman, CC Super Street, THR Street Stocks, THR Hobbies (with big changes)

Pure Stocks - CC Bombers, SAS Roadrunners, THR Grand stocks (with big changes)

Mini Stocks - CC Thunder, TPS

 

I think

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