2008 Houston Motorsports Park Rules

[Houston Motorsports Park]

Houston Motorsports Park's Technical Committee announces that it will make no major changes to its rules for the ASA Pro Late Models, Pro Modifieds, Pro Stocks and Pro Trucks for 2008. There will be only clarifications made for the existing rules. In addition, all four classes will remain on the Goodyear tires. Lap for lap, over the last two seasons at both THR and HMP, the Goodyear tires have offered the most economical and affordable option. HMP’s goal is to continue to grow a high quality racing program throughout Texas that is as affordable and economical as possible. We look forward to continuing our excellent racing relationship with Thunderhill Raceway and Mary Ann Naumann to achieve that goal for the good of the sport.

 

Sincerely,

Houston Motorsports Park's Technical Committee

[marc200mph]

Yep, those Goodyears saved me a lot of money...never could buy any new ones! LOL! Used somebody else's used up tires and that extra 200lbs and 2% less left side penalty for running what I had made me competative! LOL!

 

Oh well, when its the only place to run, guess it can't be to bad, at least I got to race.

[Trotter1t]

I never had any problems getting the tires at HMP! They were also very consistent and seemed to get faster after 50 or so laps.

[lloyd#5]

The goodyear tires are a joke.

[NickHolt]

The goodyear tires are a joke.

Actually, the Modifieds do quite well on the Goodyears. They are very repeatable and have incredibly long life with very little falloff in lap times over many heat cycles.

 

Of course, they are slower than an all-out, soft-compound racing slick, and would hardly be suitable for a SLM or PLM, for instance.

 

Nick

[Keith Garrett]

sure wish HMP would modify the rules a little so that the THR Super stocks could come run with them, guess that will never happen.

[jumbo]

Wonder what happened to reworking the weight rule for the open motor mods?

Killing a car with a weight rule sure doesn't promote new folks that might want to give pavement a try with their current equipment into doing so.

The tires are equalizer enough.

 

 

Nick-I don't think anyone has a issue with the performance of the Goodyears. The issue is with the fact that if you need a or some tires you might be able to get em and you might not. If you need a tire or 3 it sure is nice to be able to get what you need when you need it.

[marc200mph]

Tire wear is not an issue with the Goodyears, but no matter what tire you go with, if you have no way of checking for soaking/hardness or a rule on hardess, they are not an equalizer. I was told my tires were harder than anyone elses one night by an official with a durometer, when asked what other cars were reading, some were softer than the Hoosier F53's???

 

There was a supply and demand issue at THR. I waited 2 weeks and had to have my name on a list just to get 4 tires to race! Then one night I had 1 bad tire, no spares, when I wanted just one tire, they had none! Had to go through a pile of cast offs beside the tire shack to race that night. Was a cheap price, FREE.

 

Quite humorous, we had 3 mods in the pits and 1 spare. Who every had a flat first in the race was the lucky one to get it.

[firemdk]

No matter what you do with tires it's always going to be a tough spot. Unless you've got the tire business to have the goodyear or hoosier or abc tire company bring a truck out full of tires every race then your going to have a problem getting the right size or hardness of tires. The problem is selection, I buy 4 new tires from a small selection I have a hard time getting the right sizes I need without ordering special sizes every time

[Mary Ann Naumann]

There was a supply and demand issue at THR. I waited 2 weeks and had to have my name on a list just to get 4 tires to race! Then one night I had 1 bad tire, no spares, when I wanted just one tire, they had none! Had to go through a pile of cast offs beside the tire shack to race that night. Was a cheap price, FREE.

Marc, we realize that and certainly hated it as well! You guys were great, considering the situation, I would like to add that Graham and his staff, along with Jerry Spencer worked very hard to keep this from happening. Which I cannot thank them all enough! We have been a Hoosier track for many years, we wanted to give the Pro Mods & Texas Trucks an opportunity to run @ THR and still do!

 

So... if you had a choice of a tire to run @ THR, which would it be and why?

 

Please, only those that it would effect & if you would please state which car or truck you are with and only if you plan to run @ THR, if so, what would be a good number of dates you would like to see us run your class.

 

We look forward to continuing our excellent racing relationship with Thunderhill Raceway and Mary Ann Naumann to achieve that goal for the good of the sport.

Dito John, we love you guys!

 

BTW, anyone have a contact number for Jim Albert, truck #31, he called me, but did not leave me his #, if so, please email me @ maluvsracing@aol.com. Thanks!

[Truck99]

Mary Ann, I would like to see all of the classes on racing tires at THR use the same tire - either the F53 or 970. I don't really understand the rationale behind having the late models on slicks and the other classes on a different racing tire. Seems like ordering would be easier, and it would ease the financial burden on some of the guys in the lower classes due to availability of take-offs.

 

Thanks for asking.

[abrungot]

I am at stay with Hoosier's there are way to many in circulation that still can be used and i can't afford to buy new sets of goodyears to start the year out.

 

Also I am with Chase on standardize the hoosier... Personally 970 seems to be the better tire and is cheaper than the F53. Also Seems better for puncture issures, and tire wear.

Also i think Trucks and Mods were on these tires before...

 

#50 Thunderstock

[Mary Ann Naumann]

Mary Ann, I would like to see all of the classes on racing tires at THR use the same tire - either the F53 or 970. I don't really understand the rationale behind having the late models on slicks and the other classes on a different racing tire. Seems like ordering would be easier, and it would ease the financial burden on some of the guys in the lower classes due to availability of take-offs.

 

Thanks for asking.

That we are doing and for exactly the reason you stated! We are looking @ the F53 for TSRS LM, THR Thunder Stocks & A-Line Super Stocks. We too feel ordering and selection will be much better and financial for the other two classes having the opportunity for take-offs, I would be looking for a buddy in TSRS, LOL, oh, you have that part covered.

We are on the road to snowball, one of the reasons I am able to be on my computer so much! So, give me some feedback, guys. Cell phone won't work, but my sprint wirless is doing great!

[abrungot]

If you make that change over please allow us to use up the 970's we have now... I think i will be good for the first 2-4 races on the tires we have now..

[jumbo]

I like the F53 for the mod tire. I ran a weekly show for a season on 6 tires. 4 new to start the season and 2 rights midway. That was running heats, 20 lap feature and the once in a while tropy dash.

Never ran the 970 but have been told that those are good also.Either one is ok with me cause you can get both easily.

My bigger deal than the tire is the weight rule for the open motor mods. This needs to be addressed.Its not friendly to the guy that might want to give pavement a try with his existing equipment. I think that any of the tires discussed here are equalizer enough.If there has to be something done put a resticter plate on em.Plates lots cheaper than 350# of lead and easy to check with a go nogo gauge. Kill the engine if you must not the chassis.

Once a month or every third week is about as often as I can come down.I'd go race every week if ya's was closer.

 

Rick Wycough

overweight mod#48

[Nathan]

I believe that if you are going to make a class change the tires they run then I would say the TSRS would be the better class to do it to. They already are having to purchase new tires soon and more often then the other two classes. Plus that a lot of people running in thunder stock and Super stock are alredy strapped for cash when it comes to race. That is why we run in these classes because we cannot afford to run with TSRS. plus that if the 970s are cheaper then it would save the TRSR guys some money. Between me andDuane we have enought 970 pull offs to run 3/4 of the year and that would be money thrown out the window. The TRSR guys could still let the pull offs trickle down to the other teams getting back some of their money. why would you make your lower budget team have to purchase all new tires. I know that we could not afford to switch tires. I think that if you made the lower budget teams switch to more expensive tires you would see car counts drop because people could not afford to go to the new tires. so if me and Duane get a vote it would be to stay on 970s and have the TRSR change and save them some money on tire instead of making all the lower classes switch and make to were we could not afford to race next year. the only way I could see the lower class switching is if it would be for 2009 that way we could run our 970 and start get F53s together for that season otherwise it will hurt your lower classes.

[Truck99]

If you make that change over please allow us to use up the 970's we have now... I think i will be good for the first 2-4 races on the tires we have now..

 

Mary Ann, thanks for listening. Like Aaron said, please allow a few weeks for teams to use up their 970s next year IF you guys change to a different tire. Personally, I don't think the F53's are much faster than the 970s, if they are at all. The 970 is a pretty darn good tire. But either way, it would be great to see all the classs on the same rubber.

[Mel]

What would be the difference between the price of the 3 tires? (an estimated price)

 

F53's, 970's, Goodyears.

 

Also is there much difference in the roll-outs of the three different tires.

 

Is the side-wall construction similar, how bout durometer?

 

Thanks, Mel

[speed demon 7]

Last season I ran 970's, which were good tires, then went to the f53's, and they were fast, but also faded fast. This year I ran the Goodyears all season, except for a couple races. I won on both tires, but I like the Goodyears best. They are cheaper, they last longer, and they don't give up as much as the other 2. The last race of the season, my left front had 8 races on it, my right sides had about 6 races and my left front was a used tire. The mod guys like them too. On the Goodyears, they can run several races, on the Hoosiers, they had to buy new tires every race to stay competitive because of the difference in times over the new and used tires. I am happy to hear that we will be staying on these tires at HMP. Good call Graham.

[marc200mph]

Arthur, I a mod guy and have trouble with the Goodyears!

 

Ok...my opinion, and this is from a very low budget racing opinion!

 

The F53's are a high costing tire, they are the fastest tire! If you are going to be fastest each week that means 4 new tires each and every 50 lap race! $$$$$$$$$$$

 

The Goodyears are a good tire, last longer and a few dollars cheaper. But we are talking THR here not Houston, what is best and most economical for all involved, no other classes run on Goodyear except Mods & Trucks. (Hope I am right about that, Mary Ann?) There was a supply and demand issue all of last year!

 

The 970's are a good longer lasting tire, THR's other classes already run them. They are a good equalizer in the mods as they do not hook up like an F53, (or a soaked Goodyear,LOL!), 970's would make THR an all Hoosier tire track could also help bottom end $$$ for both THR and the racers. (lot of used tires to pass down to lower classes, no supply problem) I know the hoosier distributor would work with THR on point funds, trophies, discounts, kickbacks, etc... (what is Goodyear doing?) Note: this could happen on the F53 as well but I am talking cost in this senario.

 

With the mods & trucks on 970's you can eliminate the added on weight, less left side % for each differant engine combination. The tire would be the equalizer! Keep all the other mod rules the same getting a way from intense tech issues, carbs, etc... Just inforce a hardness rule, durometer reading.

 

JMO from an old racer of 32 years who may be on the senile side! LOL!

 

PS: Let's go back to Yesteryear..TAMS days, F53's on engine rule cars, open engines on 970's. Full field of cars, B mains, good racing, etc...

 

NOTE: Racing teams with lots of $$$$ money to spend will not like tires that slow you down. If you get upset about my statements, go NASCAR Truck racing and leave use poor racers alone!

 

Again JMO, Marc

[speed demon 7]

Sorry, I didn't realize that the thread said THR Rules... hehehe...J/K. I think the Mods and trucks were brought over as HMP classes as well as the Pro Lates. They were not originally on the schedule? If Hoosier is the only option, than the 970's are the way to go. But I know 4 mods that were a part of the deal to run both tracks that won't come to THR on Hoosiers. If THR runs them on a full schedule, than that is a different story, but if they run them like they did this year, as a invite from HMP for 4-6 races, goodyears are the only way to go, since most the cars that ran over there were HMP regulars. Whatever happens, I still think the Goodyears are the best overall tire. Less falloff on lap times, longer lasting, and you can win on 4 race old tires.

[firemdk]

If you step back and read these posts it's kind of funny actually. The Hoosier vs. Goodyear is like the Ford Vs. Chevy conversations. I have run on both tires and think that the 970 and the Goodyear have their positives and negatives. They are both excellent tires and are good at their niche. What needs to be looked at is not like we've had in other conversations the kyle vs. houston, but what is good for area racing in general.

 

As was mentioned in several posts last year, the goodyear rubber does not like the hoosier rubber on the track, for good competition we need to have the same rubber.

[jracer98]

No need to re invent the wheel. What has worked best, so far, and was the easiest entry for a new car to try pavement?

 

TD et al, changed all "types" of mods to a single tire. Car count.... up or down? Gas only ...up or down? A dirt car with a vanilla 383 had to buy a complete gas fuel system and add 400 pounds of lead in a way that balances at 56% left....seen many curious dirt cars trying pavement lately? Can't imagine why not.

 

so, Mary Ann, to answer your question, F53's on crate mods, Tams gas 2 bbl and Tams alcohol 2bbl. 970's on open motored mods. If this years statistics show that the crates need a little weight hung on the Tams (or vice versa), then do it. All run at 58% left and you're done...no mystery, everybody has seen it work. If Goodyear had better availability and a slower tire for the open cars that would be fine, but it's still a "guess" instead of returning to a "known". I have no problem with the Goodyear tire itself.

 

 

As far as racing dates go, I have enough time for about half a dozen THR races. It seems no matter which 6 I get the time off for, 1 or 2 rain out and a work crisis usually kills 1 too.

 

JMO

 

Jay

[Truck38]

I really liked the goodyears we did not see our lap times drop off like the ARs or even the H970's like seasons before.

 

I ran the same tires for 5 races and my fastest times were the last race. I did have to replace one that was damaged from contact with another driver but it was only one and I turned my fastest qualifying time that last race when 3 of my tires had 6 races on them.

 

As for getting the right sizes, we couldn't get the GY to grow with air pressure but we started putting 45lbs in them and letting them sit in the sun before we put them on and we could get them to grow 1/2 to 3/4 an inch just sitting there in the sun for 10 or 15 minutes.

[Houston Motorsports Park]

The 8” Goodyear tires are $100 plus tax at HMP. As reported by the racers in this thread, they are competitive for a minimum of 4 race meetings with some reporting even more. The available roll out ranges up to 2 ¾” maximum.

 

There has never been a supply shortage of 8” Goodyear tires at HMP. HMP has always maintained adequate inventory to have stagger options available. In addition, HMP has always made its entire inventory available, at cost, to THR for all races. To make it even more convenient and financially viable, HMP supplied the tires with no upfront cost and only requested payment for the tires that were actually sold. In addition, all unsold stock could be and has been returned free of charge. Often times, Graham even made the arrangements with racers to get the tires delivered to THR. However, HMP admits that it cannot control the supply requests from the THR supplier nor can HMP control the quantity that they maintain on hand. If a shortage at THR ever occurred, it would have only taken a simple phone call to make arrangements to get additional tires, to meet demands, sent to THR.