landlord Posted November 24, 2007 Report Share Posted November 24, 2007 Ok.. can i play stupid.. because i am in this area.. The aftermarket clip is $170 less than the stock replacement.. If you go with the aftermarket replacement, what does that allow you to do vs. the Stock clip.. Is there Performance advantages? Weight, geo?, Better parts on the corners? And how much does it cost for those other parts? The aftermarket is way more adjustable and has rack&pinion steering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waddy Posted November 24, 2007 Report Share Posted November 24, 2007 It's more! $765 vs. $595 So what is the purpose of running these front clips that went out with the dinosaurs???? its the freaking rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landlord Posted November 24, 2007 Report Share Posted November 24, 2007 It's more! $765 vs. $595 So what is the purpose of running these front clips that went out with the dinosaurs???? its the freaking rules Ever heard of evolution?Just like everything else the sport evolves like it or not.Always has and always will!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSCHUCK Posted November 24, 2007 Report Share Posted November 24, 2007 Changing the rules for the few instead of not changing the rules for the many has been common. That is why the dinosaur I was racing has been extinct along with the several others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ups88john Posted November 24, 2007 Report Share Posted November 24, 2007 if it aint broke dont fix it, tsrs had good car count all year and they do allow a 2x4 replacement, just no racks. big john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truck99 Posted November 24, 2007 Report Share Posted November 24, 2007 Ok.. can i play stupid.. because i am in this area.. The aftermarket clip is $170 less than the stock replacement.. If you go with the aftermarket replacement, what does that allow you to do vs. the Stock clip.. Is there Performance advantages? Weight, geo?, Better parts on the corners? And how much does it cost for those other parts? The same parts (suspension and steering) bolt up to the 2x4 fab clip as the stock clip. The 2x4 fab clip can be had with R&P or stock type steering. Of course, stock type is required to be TSRS legal. The fab clip is lighter than the camaro clip, but rules require the placement of a 25lb weight near the front of the car on fab clip cars. Some of the fab clips allow vertical adjustment of the lower control arms pivot points, but Jack requires these to be welded up once they are set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gundogC3 Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 We need a head count on tube-vs-stock. The tube car is going to be the C.O.T. of TSRS. I would like to see how many tube, coilover,stock chassis there are running. Anyone want to chime in on what you run? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waddy Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 tube, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer61 Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 We need a head count on tube-vs-stock. The tube car is going to be the C.O.T. of TSRS. I would like to see how many tube, coilover,stock chassis there are running. Anyone want to chime in on what you run? I guess im a little dense, but how is it "COT". Same parts, same weight(with penalty), close on geometry. As far as I can tell, the only significant differance is motorplacement. The motor can be lowered more on the fab clip. As ss99 stated, Jack wants the adjustments welded before first race. So again I ask, whats the big deal? As far as dinosaur, If these are so out of date, how is it that they are getting the most cars? Must be doing something right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Aramendia Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 The 79 car and the 50 car are stock clip and big spring. Joe Aramendia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landlord Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 We need a head count on tube-vs-stock. The tube car is going to be the C.O.T. of TSRS. I would like to see how many tube, coilover,stock chassis there are running. Anyone want to chime in on what you run? I guess im a little dense, but how is it "COT". Same parts, same weight(with penalty), close on geometry. As far as I can tell, the only significant differance is motorplacement. The motor can be lowered more on the fab clip. As ss99 stated, Jack wants the adjustments welded before first race. So again I ask, whats the big deal? As far as dinosaur, If these are so out of date, how is it that they are getting the most cars? Must be doing something right. The most cars?Those cars can only race 2 tracks.You guys put on a great show but the front end is out of date!!!!.The Pro Late Model class is the future.For proof all you have to do is look at the Snowball entry thread!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hray Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 Actually, if you put 10" tires on a TSRS car with this new clip, I believe you could run with the ProLates, but then you'd have a big spring ProLate wouldn't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gundogC3 Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 Cory, there running out of Camaro clip's is what I meant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer61 Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 Cory, there running out of Camaro clip's is what I meant. I understand gunnar. I believe the tube replacement is by far the best way to go because of the direct replacement. No more scavenging boneyards for an iffy clip. I just dont understand why the issue of technology. The camaro, nova clip has been in race cars ever since it came out. Its actually pretty good geometry from the factory and the tube replacement allows you to get even closer. So what is the point of converting the TSRS cars to basically a slm with better than a crate engine. Like someone said earlier in this thread,"if it aint broke, dont fix it". Landlord, the snowball always has had a long entry list. And has never had every car arrive. Not even in 1999. Probably the biggest snowball ever. God that was a blast. The entry list for TSRS is pretty long itself. The pro-late model class is thriving because of lack of options. The slm teams and late model stock teams have not much of an option if they plan to continue racing. Good class, bad class doesnt really matter if it is the only game around. As far as the limited amount of tracks the TSRS runs on, well do you think that if there were any asphalt tracks around, Mary Ann and H would be on the phone to them. Again, lack of options. JMFO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Ann Naumann Posted November 28, 2007 Report Share Posted November 28, 2007 We need a head count on tube-vs-stock. The tube car is going to be the C.O.T. of TSRS. Sorry guys, just like it is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishracer Posted November 29, 2007 Report Share Posted November 29, 2007 First off, car count by default isn't really car count. If its the only game in town are the racers being taken advantage of in a way. The old take it or leave attitude. I am sure it would be a lot easier pill to swallow if some of the rules made real dollars and sense. For example: Hanging weight on tube front clips cars to offset the difference for stock clip cars, first off this requires drilling holes in the clips hampering the intergrity of the frame or welding plates in odd places that makes working on the engine difficult. Hell, if there so scared of them make the tube cars have an engine height 1/4-3/8" higher, thats about the difference in the center of gravity. Center of gravity is the compensator. Not allowing the evil coilover, thats just plain misquided. The big spring guys are using the same shocks(out of control by the way). The unsprung weight deal is miniscule when the weight of the car is 3000lbs. Joe Armendia won the Sas championship two years ago with a stock clip car running against the 2X4 coilover Nascar Late Model Stocks and was dominant. There are several Latemodel Stocks that would probably be brought out of mothballs if they were not so penalized to the point that they are uncompetitive. We are saving money by continuing to run 8" tires. How is it saving money when these cars have the horsepower they do but they can't stop or they are overdriven causing all the wrecks and cautions. For the weight of these cars they need either bigger brakes or 10" tires with a bigger footprint so they can stop them. Along with that the drivers will have much better car control when they get them out of shape. How is replacing body parts and clips every couple of weeks saving money. Yea everyone might have to go by some wheels but hell with the rate their wrecking cars the wheels are the less expensive alternative. Modifieds do well on the 8" because they weigh less. As for the shock situation, for a lower dollar latemodel series there sure are some high dollar shocks being allowed. Yea, Yea I know the story I only need 1 shock to do the job of 10. Yes but if you made everyone run a $60.00 welded bearing shock, even if you had 10 shocks its still less than 1 of the shocks most of the front runners are using, and when you wreck one on your 8" tire economical latemodel your only out $60.00 not $500.00-$1000. Using technology as an exuse not to police this is crazy. The carb rule is also a joke. You can talk to any carb engineer in the country and they will tell you that unless you make the holes bigger in the carb or pickup air from somewhere else, the internal modification of the carbuerator is only for throttle response. The idea is good for trying to keep the cost down so no one has to buy and a modified carb. If the booster height , the venturi size and air leaks are checked for thats really all that needs to be done. This internal thing that is checked for, no one else in the country does, whats makes this series have the monopoly on carb knowledge. Lots of legal carbs anywhere else in the country have been put on the shelf. Why not let the pro lates run, especially if you had a 10" tire just make them weigh 50 lbs more than the regular tsrs latemodels, raise their motors 1" to offset the aluminum heads and 2x3 clip. If the cars are close to the same weight and have the same left side weight the center of gravity should be close. As for the rack and pinion, the car doesnt care what kind of steering is moving the tires. Hell the chassis on these are alot easier to repair and maintain and less expensive in the long run than a stock clip car. Car count makes dollars be counted. I believe if TSRS would qualify their success and open up their minds to possible improvements,which in the long run would save money for the racer and grow the series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
97car Posted November 29, 2007 Report Share Posted November 29, 2007 Seems they already have a better car count then the pro lates do already, and if drivers learn when to back off and give each other room then the 8" tires are not a big deal, besides the bigger tires the more power can be put down to the ground and covers up the handling crutches some already have, and again how many cars came from out east for any of the races other then the bigshot races and the 10K to win ASA races, not many. Texas has to do what they need to do for Texas racing, not anyone else, it would be nice if they could rotate the top classes between the 3 existing paved tracks and give the fans variety, but not many of the pro-latemodels choose to travel in Texas. Don't get me wrong, I do agree with some of your suggestions, but part of the problem in the late models has been constant changes all of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer61 Posted December 1, 2007 Report Share Posted December 1, 2007 but part of the problem in the late models has been constant changes all of the time. AMEN BROTHER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jont66 Posted December 1, 2007 Report Share Posted December 1, 2007 IF IT'S WORKING, THEN LEAVE IT ALONE! DON'T LET THE DRIVERS & CREWS WRITE THE RULES. YOU'LL CHANGE FOR A FEW, AND RUN OFF THE MAJORITY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyhorse Posted December 2, 2007 Report Share Posted December 2, 2007 IF IT'S WORKING, THEN LEAVE IT ALONE! DON'T LET THE DRIVERS & CREWS WRITE THE RULES. YOU'LL CHANGE FOR A FEW, AND RUN OFF THE MAJORITY. exactly . i don't understand how this topic has lived so long,,,,,,,she ain't changing the rules but people are argueing like she is or should? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gundogC3 Posted December 2, 2007 Report Share Posted December 2, 2007 I think Fishracer was the only one talking about rules. I was just curious on what diferent team's where running. And thank's Joe and Lealand for your imput. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toy box racing Posted December 2, 2007 Report Share Posted December 2, 2007 10 in TIRES please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truck99 Posted December 2, 2007 Report Share Posted December 2, 2007 10 in TIRES please. But why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyhorse Posted December 2, 2007 Report Share Posted December 2, 2007 i'd be embarassed to ask for driving assistance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toy box racing Posted December 2, 2007 Report Share Posted December 2, 2007 MaMa I just wanna go FAST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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