THR drivers......SAFETY!

[rebelracewriter]

Awkward silence......crickets chirping.....

[wheelchair49]

Looks like everyone is all of a sudden bored with this thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[RBSF]

Yep, I kinda got that too...... And I understand, I really do. I just wish a few out of the hundreds that viewed it would actually respond to the specific questions I had. No bashing, attacking, hurt feelers, just real answers.

Thanks.

[BamaChief]

Ill get back to you on this....I have had something typed twice and twice my computer has eaten it. I will walk away before I have to replace my laptop....Technology is wonderful!!!!!

[jwmbishop]

Those that want to take a proactive approach will, those that don't won't. And you will always have a least resistant path down which many will wander - especially given the demands in our busy lives.

[BamaChief]

Have fuel cell rollover/flapper valves improved? Have on-board fire systems become more cost effective? Are all tracks providing a high level of emergency response? Are drivers taking a more active role in track safety? Are there any good arguments against participating with the rollover simulator now available? Do new car designs incorporate safe and rapid exits? Do tracks actively tech safety equipment? Do people still believe a single-layer fire suit will protect them? Are fire extinguishers popping up in the pits and around haulers? Irregardless of the potential pain and suffering, do people stop to look at the economics of a great safety program?

What can we do better, is what I'm asking....

 

Anyone??

 

 

Ok I will give it a shot:

1. I do not know if the fuel cells have gotten better. I have not seen any fuel cell fires at our track and everyone has stayed on the ground and not on the lid.

2.I doubt they have become any cheaper.Anything we buy in the fire service is expensive so I figure its the same.

3.I will say no. Some of the tracks I have been to think a few extinguishers on the wrecker and clean-up truck will work.

4.Some drivers do but others do not.

5.I have no argument against it. I have not seen a simulator in our state.

6.Im not sure what else can be done short of roof trap doors.

7.I do not think all tracks tech the equipment as good as they should be.

8.I think they will protect the driver to a certain degree if there is some type of clothing under them.

9.I would like to think that teams carry extinguishers in their haulers for their own safety.

10.I would hope not...Safety has no price in my book.

 

What can we do better?

1.Before every racing season certify that cars are safe before they can race.

2.Ensure your track has an adequate safety program in place.

3.Remind the teams that safety on their vehicle starts in their shop.

There are more things that come to mind that are manufacturer issues and Im not sure where to start.

 

Im sure I will think of more things later.......

[NickHolt]

...What can we do better?

1.Before every racing season certify that cars are safe before they can race...

 

OK. Let's get Reb, BamaChief and RBSF together at Podunk Speedway next season and have them tech the cars that run there for safety. These guys obviously know about safety. Their emphasis and knowledge on track safety are well documented right here on Lone Star Speedzone. So, they look each car over with a fine-tooth comb and certify the cars as "safe."

 

However, Bubba, who has a major national sponsor and several successful local businesses as sponsors, goes out, hits the wall and dies because they all failed to see that one of the major structural components of the car was actually make out of exhaust tubing rather than the required tubing.

 

Now lawyer McSleeze reads the paper, sees $$ floating through his noggin and next thing you know the track is shut down, BamaChief, Reb and RBSF all have to hire very expensive lawyers to protect whatever assets McSleeze is trying to put in his own bank and the national sponsor ends up paying McSleeze a few hundred thousand buck for being a sponsor, which, of course, they will never do again, and none of the successful businesses that supported racing in that area would get within a mile of any race track from then on.

 

Similar scenarios (but obviously with a different set of variables) have happened at the local level and at the highest level.

 

The key is that the track, its tech officials and sponsors are NOT responsible for driver safety. The drivers are responsible for their own safety. When the track certifies a car and the related safety equipment is safe, the track becomes the responsible party, not the driver and if the safety equipment fails, the track may well be judged to be legally liable.

 

Now, should the track encourage driver safety? Of course. Should Reb continue to aggressively bring safety concerns to our attention? Of course. Should RBSF continue to bring his simulator to as many tracks as possible? Of course. Should tech officials look for safety issues? Without a doubt. Should tracks certify that a car and other safety equipment is safe? Absolutely not.

 

Nick

[jwmbishop]

Right on the mark Nick... Clean bullseye.

[RBSF]

Thank you, BamaChief, that response is EXACTLY the type I am looking for, even if it does come from a safety crew member.

I would have no desire nor ability to hang a certification on anyone's equipment, BUT as a tech official I am entitled/required to enforce whatever rules the track and sanctioning bodies have in place.

My questions are more of a "finger on the pulse" of how people FEEL, and what can be improved. I believe what AJ posted earlier is fairly common with regard to the overall safety issues, and I certainly understand why.

Safety IS mostly up to the drivers, no doubt, how can I/we help? Shut up? Go away and leave everyone alone? Believe me, it's real tempting. The rollover simulator does absolutely nothing for me except cost me time and money, so why pursue it? Here's why: A late night phone call from a safety crew member thanking me because they just experienced what I worked with them on, or a post praising a crew for their ability to turn a potential issue into a non-event because they knew exactly how to respond, or a young man that couldn't get out because of his choice in arm restraints vs a net, or a driver that learned his gut is too big to allow the belts to release properly. Those are my wages. I have gotten to the point where I will pay a first-timer $10 if their exit time is less than their fire suit rating. It breaks my heart when so many people tell me what a great tool this is and should be mandatory, yet 99% of the people it's there for walk by. So, I am reminded by people who actually care that if it saves ONE LIFE it's worth it. It is, and that's a fact.

Thanks again BamaChief for taking a stab at those questions, the answers help in moving forward.

[wheelchair49]

RBSF: Looks like they woke up again. I'v got 2 sons that race and 1 grandson that races. We build the race cars as safe as possible, we try to go beyond minumun safety. We use the best fire equipment. But you still can't predict everything such as the broken ball joint on Cory's #61 pro-mod last week that Robert was driving. We could have gone into the front wall also the wreck that Robert totaled the #10 last time In Houston. We build crush zones in the front. We have a safety check list that is gone over and checked of before the race car goes back on the track. After 25 years in racing I could go on all day and night about things that have gone wrong!! Oh RBSF I should tell you our home track is Thunderhill Raceway, Kyle, Texas outside Austin, run by the beautiful Mary Ann Naumann.

[RBSF]

We have a safety check list that is gone over and checked of before the race car goes back on the track.

SWEET!!!! Excellent deal, amigo. I am under no illusions about how stuff can or won't happen, that's not just racing, that's life!

Thanks

[BamaChief]

Well my use of the term Certify was more along the lines of your tracks rules. I still think all the cars need to pass a safety inspection at their respective tracks. Ultimately safety when building a car is the drivers/team responsibility. I have a saying I always use at the fire house when we do vehicle extrication training. "You cant stop a dumba$$ from being a dumba$$."

[rebelracewriter]

"You cant stop a dumba$$ from being a dumba$$."

 

LMAOOOOO...Now that I can agree with...

 

 

OK. Let's get Reb, BamaChief and RBSF together at Podunk Speedway next season and have them tech the cars that run there for safety.

 

Not sure where you're going with that remark.....But.....Last weekend at I-37 I was talking to a driver who was praising my safety "crusade" efforts and asked if I could do something at the track for everyone.....So I told him OK, I'll start with your car.....I made several RECOMMENDATIONS on a few things I saw....I highly doubt that makes me libel to any litigation....

 

So you're saying no one should do any safety tech/check??????

 

On a side note....Kudos to Wesley Skains for bringing about 2-3 dozen old fire extinguishers to the track....It's my understanding they all are in working order and/or charged BUT their age eliminates them from being recertified for commercial/industrial use.....Perhaps Greg could elaborate more on this...

[BamaChief]

Oh something to look for on the age of fire extinguishers. If the extinguisher you get is from Wal-Mart or other retail store they are usually not rechargeable. The rechargeable extinguishers have dates stamped in the neck or on the bottom. They have to be hydrostat tested every 3-5 years. Im thinking 5 if it is a steel bottle. They can still be used past their Hydro date but cannot be refilled if they are beyond their Hydro limit. It is a good idea to shake them up from time to time so the powder will not cake in the bottom.

[dirtracer99]

reb took a look at my car sat. and i realized that some of the changes you can make to your car are priceless and nearly effortless.. Thanks for the advice reb.!

[RBSF]

reb took a look at my car sat. and i realized that some of the changes you can make to your car are priceless and nearly effortless.. Thanks for the advice reb.!

Bingo! Thanks for being open to suggestions.

[RBSF]

I had a big guy in Flipr yesterday, cleared the car in 13 seconds first time, got hung up second time on his Hans.

Hans' fault? Driver's fault for being big? WHO CARES!!!! Ya gotta look past blame to the real root cause. Although the driver-side opening is typical in size, it isn't big enough to fit everyone, yet car builders really don't alter that area much in design. I would have expected the Hans to get hung in the window net, but actually the rigid upright portion got wedged in the window opening in the corner of the roof. So what do you do, ditch the Hans? Alter the window opening? Diet? At least now this guy has something to go back and look at his car for, that's proactive, and turning negative to positive by simple experience.

[abrungot]

I am one of those big guys and i will tell you this.. My Door opening does have a little more space...

I have been trying to get Flipr to THR for several months.. still can't seem to find a date that works....

[ProTree]

Bama,I've always liked a phrase similar to your's,"if they go to bed stupid tonite,they're going wake up stupid in the morning"