poorboy Posted August 12, 2006 Report Share Posted August 12, 2006 I already have my opinion about this but I would like to here other opinions especially Pacecar's. Should stagger be used for tuning a chassi or should you find the correct stagger for a track and not change it to correct handling if other adjustments are possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted August 12, 2006 Report Share Posted August 12, 2006 I SET OUR CARS UP AS CLOSE AS POSIBLE WITH AS LITTLE STAGGER AS I CAN THEN I THROW ALL KINDS ON IT TO SEE WHAT IT DOES .THEN TWEEK IT TO WHERE IF I CANT FIND THE STAGGER I WANT IN TIRES IT WONT HURT ME THAT MUCH RACEING THAT NIGHT OUR CAR WILL RUN WITHIN ONE TENTH OF LAP SPEED AT CC GOING FROM ONE AND A HALF FRONT TO TWO AND A HALF ACROSS ,AND 0 TO ONE IN ,REAR . IN KYLE I CAN GET AWAY WITH . NO STAGGER IN REAR .AND OR A HALF.DOES NOT SLOW IT DOWN . IN THE FRONT I CAN EITHER RUN TWO AND A HALF ACROSS .FRONT OR THREE . AND ALL THAT HALF DOES TO THE CAR IS CHANG THE INTRANCE ANGLE JUST A LITTLE . AND JUST A SMALL CHANGE ON EXIT . NOW THAT IS A 95 INCH WHEEL BASE .AND THE CAR IS FAST AND HANDLES GREAT .AND DOES NOT FADE . ALSO I DONT LIKE TO RUN ANYMORE THAN I HAVE TO IT TENDS TO SLOW THE CAR DOWN SPEED WISE AND AT SAS I DONT WANT THE DRAG . I KNOW I MAY HAVE A WIERD SET UP BUT IT WORKS . YOU NEVER SET A CAR UP WITH ANYMORE WEDGE THAN YOU HAVE TO.BUT NO MATTER WHAT IT WILL ALWAYS TAKE STAGGER AND AIR PRESSURE TO GET YOUR DESIRED FILL FOR YOU AND YOUR CAR .ALSO ONE MORE THING I HAVE NOT MADE ONE ADJUTS MENT ON OUR CAR IN TWO YEARS .AS FOR AS MY MAIN SET UP . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tps48 Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 I think old Mader should get an honorary proffessorship at the Nick Holt Academy of Racing Sciences. I would not have guessed that he knew anything about staggering except how to do it. (Stagger that is.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 I think old Mader should get an honorary proffessorship at the Nick Holt Academy of Racing Sciences. I would not have guessed that he knew anything about staggering except how to do it. (Stagger that is.) i read that out of a book .nah that aint it i stole it from nick . mike did you learn something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 i read that out of a book .nah that aint it i stole it from nick . mike did you learn something I don't think so.... LOL Actually, the goal with rear stagger is to use the amount that the radius of the turn and the banking angle at the critical point of the turn (usually somewhere pretty close to the apex) calls for. This can be figured out mathmatically, but there are several handy charts that are available, including the one I use in my suspension seminars. The idea is this. If you were to take the rear end (or front end on a fwd car) out of the vehicle and set it down at the beginning of the turn, then give it a magical kick to start it around the corner, you would want the tires staggered so that the rear end would run all by itself around the corner without rolling towards the infield or towards the outside wall. That amount of stagger is pretty close to what you should be running. Once you have the correct stagger, adjust other things like spring rates, weight percentages, to obtain balance in the car. Use stagger only as a fine tuning device. One of the challenges is to find tires that match the tire pressures your car calls for and provides the correct amount of rear stagger. Nick Holt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kn1ghtblade Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 NICK When and where are your seminars and how much do they cost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 I usually hold two seminars a year during the off season - one in the Austin/San Marcos area and one in the San Antonio area. I occasionally have a seminar in the Houston area if there seems to be enough interest in that neck of the woods. The seminars are six weeks long. We meet once a week (usually a Tues or Weds) for three hours at a time (usually from 7 pm until 10 pm). That may seem like a long time, but the most common suggestion I get in my course evaluations is that the seminars were too short - that they would have preferred to extend the course another few weeks. I limit the class size to 15 people. Any more than that and I can't keep track of who's absorbing the information and who's not. The cost is $300 per person. About 80 pages of class notes are provided along with a couple of computer programs to help with figuring wheel rates and spring rates. I hope to make an announcement about the San Antonio Seminar soon. Thanks for asking. Nick Holt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txtom Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Poorboy, You only need to look as far as Big John for all your stagger questions. He has staggered more than anyone else on this board. .....oops, wrong kind of stagger. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kn1ghtblade Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Cool thanks Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poorboy Posted August 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Nick I would appreciate it if you would not use my thread for selling your seminar. LOL My opinion follows your theory on stagger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoom Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Nick I would appreciate it if you would not use my thread for selling your seminar. LOL My opinion follows your theory on stagger. He is learning the fine art of self promotion from TQJ3 pretty subtle huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Mark and Bruce, Just answered the man's question. Sorry if I offended. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 when i started raceing no one would help you and if they did you could not trust what they said so i spent alot of time trying out things there was no nick back then .i bet he could teach this old dog a new trick . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poorboy Posted August 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Hey Nick I thought the "LOL" would let you know I was joking. Maybe I will have a sense of humor seminar and let you in for free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ford12 Posted August 15, 2006 Report Share Posted August 15, 2006 Hey Nick I thought the "LOL" would let you know I was joking. Maybe I will have a sense of humor seminar and let you in for free. Thats funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted August 15, 2006 Report Share Posted August 15, 2006 Bruce, There are some things you can't teach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cRt racing Posted August 21, 2006 Report Share Posted August 21, 2006 mike you just didnt know the right people when i started i had rick rapp help set my car up he showed me what i was doing wrong and how to correct my problems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted August 21, 2006 Report Share Posted August 21, 2006 mike you just didnt know the right people when i started i had rick rapp help set my car up he showed me what i was doing wrong and how to correct my problems YEA AND YOU STILL HAVENT FIGURED IT OUT WHO MADE YOUR DADS CAR GO FAST .HMMM I THINK HIS NAME IS MIKE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landlord Posted October 28, 2006 Report Share Posted October 28, 2006 I occasionally have a seminar in the Houston area if there seems to be enough interest in that neck of the woods. Are you having one in Houston this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted October 28, 2006 Report Share Posted October 28, 2006 I occasionally have a seminar in the Houston area if there seems to be enough interest in that neck of the woods. Are you having one in Houston this year? I would love to have one in Houston. It's been quite a few years since we had the last one there. It would be in January and February. You interested? Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landlord Posted November 1, 2006 Report Share Posted November 1, 2006 I occasionally have a seminar in the Houston area if there seems to be enough interest in that neck of the woods. Are you having one in Houston this year? I would love to have one in Houston. It's been quite a few years since we had the last one there. It would be in January and February. You interested? Nick Yes,count me in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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