tricknology Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 ROLL CAGE PICTURES, simple and easy this cage only has 6 bends total, four 45 degree bends and two 90 degree bends. this cage design attaches the cage to the FWD unibody super structure. the cage is welded to the A, B, and C pillars, the rocker sill, and the roof box sections. It also ties the front firewall to the rear strut towers. the floor boards on a fwd 4 cyl does not have much strength, and is not a principle part of the superstructure,,, some bars have been left out for clairity when the pics were shot,,,such as the dash bar , the shoulder bar behind the seat, and some of the door bars. these bars will be installed later and more pics will be posted. also all the door bars are straight,,,because the distance from the outside of the door to the inside is very narrow. As we add more bars we will post more pics. Click on link to see teh roll cage pictures on the Michigan Short Track Racing Club forum,,, http://www.mstrc.com/index.php?showtopic=16771 also as a side note here are some links to other tech info sites,,, see sleepy trip's Oval track digest for more tech info http://www.ovaltrackdigest.com/article-directory.htm and http://www.4m.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neon14 Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Thats kind of a stange way to build a roll cage dosnt really look that strong to me from the picks. The best bang for the buck is the basic mini stock roll cage that everybody sells. Its all pre bent and ready to weld in. Thats what I have put into all the neons that I have built. You cant beat the price and its legal to run at prolly any circle track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickHolt Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 I like the idea that you are thinking out of the box, but when it comes to roll cages, you really should stick with the tried and true. I really didn't see a lot of triangulation in your design - perhaps that comes later, but straight, long pieces of tubing with little triangulation is not the safest way to go in my opinion. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 THAT CAGE SCARES ME ... this MAY HELP SOME IN ROLL OVER .. BUT SIDE HITS ..AT THIS POINT I WOULD NOT CONSIDER THIS IDEAL ..LETS SEE WHERE THEY GO WITH IT ..I LIKE NEON14 .CAGE ..HE ROLLED A FEW TIMES ON DIRT AND SERVIVED... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tricknology Posted January 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Please scroll thru these tech artical links that have pics of the Factory type safety cages,,you will note that the floor pan is not included in these pics. Everyone who builds/races a moderan FWD Uni-body car should attach their cage to the A-Pillar, B-pillar, the C-pillar, the rocker panel, and the roof box sections. the floor pan is not a primary part of this factory safety cage. MOST of the cages sold only attach to the WEAK FLOOR. They DO NOT attach their cage to the A-Pillar, B-pillar, the C-pillar, the rocker panel, and the roof box sections. the floor pan is not a primary part of this factory safety cage. http://www.sae.org/automag/globalvehicles/10-2002/page2.htm http://www.aluminum.org/AluminumNow/featur...304f1safety.htm I am posting this for effect ,,Again,,, some bars have been left out for clairity when the pics were shot,,,such as the dash bar , the shoulder bar behind the seat, and some of the door bars. these bars will be installed later and more pics will be posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tricknology Posted January 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 Thats kind of a stange way to build a roll cage dosnt really look that strong to me from the picks. The best bang for the buck is the basic mini stock roll cage that everybody sells. Its all pre bent and ready to weld in. Thats what I have put into all the neons that I have built. You cant beat the price and its legal to run at prolly any circle track. have you ever seen a Sprint car chassis or a Super modifided chassis or a scca formula ford chassis? well here are some pics,,, On sprint car,,their hoops are like our design,,the run for and aft,,with welded in bars behind the drivers head,,, http://rides.webshots.com/photo/1135000321043605112whUxHD http://rides.webshots.com/photo/1104346834043605112KKltlU http://rides.webshots.com/photo/1104346769043605112WRePvA http://rides.webshots.com/photo/1104346616043605112lGlzAH http://rides.webshots.com/photo/1104344604043605112wUOaIq THAT CAGE SCARES ME ... this MAY HELP SOME IN ROLL OVER .. BUT SIDE HITS ..AT THIS POINT I WOULD NOT CONSIDER THIS IDEAL ..LETS SEE WHERE THEY GO WITH IT ..I LIKE NEON14 .CAGE ..HE ROLLED A FEW TIMES ON DIRT AND SERVIVED... I am posting this for effect ,,Again,,, these pics are showing the first phases of construction,,NOTE none of the bars have even been welded in yet. some bars have been left out for clairity when the pics were shot,,,such as the dash bar , the shoulder bar behind the seat, and some of the door bars. these bars will be installed later and more pics will be posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tricknology Posted January 26, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 here is pic of a EAGLE Sprint car chassis Note that the vertical bars infront of the driver and just behind the driver are welded in,,as are the perpendicular bars over the drivers head... the cage has a long halo bar that runs for and aft. http://www.eaglechassis.com/dirt%20sprint2.pdf http://www.eaglechassis.com/images/07_images/Kitcarright.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuttingEdgeRacing Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 You will probably get around most of the small hometown track inspectors with something like that. But a real tech inspector will never let that fly. You cannot compare a neon to a sprint car. That sprint car doesnt have the weight or CG of a Neon. Take that car into ANY OTHER sports car association and it will not pass tech. NASCAR, SCCA, NASA, IHRA, NHRA, ALMS, doesnt matter...all of them mandate having a main roll cage hoop behind the driver. Secondly, that long tube is not going to support but 20% of the roll over load. You are still relying on your impact force transfering down through the tube you've added under the traingulation bars, which still just hit the door rails. I could type for an hour about the problems I see in this cage..but its just not worth it. A tech inspector can tell you. Call one..its worth it before you weld everything together. I agree with you, no one should weld bars straight to floor pans. But real cage builders build rocker boxes, outriggers and add structural support to accomidate week floors. I have building cages for a while now, and have ventured out and made these same moves. I know you will defend this cage to death...I did too. But roll cages have been done for 50 years now, ask yourself why they don't look like yours.. and please don't compare sprint cars to full body cars. I can hear the keys flying now.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuttingEdgeRacing Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 I have one other issue with this cage... One good hard shot in to side of this car, and it comprimises the integrity of the rollover structures. Hit that lower sill plate bar, you've now moved the entire side structure of the roll cage. I'm sorry, but the more I look at these pictures, the less I believe in the cage. It just can't work like this in a full body car, with no tubular frame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tricknology Posted January 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 You are wrong,,, this cage has been apporved by the major oval tracks in Michigan,and Ohio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truck99 Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 You are wrong,,, this cage has been apporved by the major oval tracks in Michigan,and Ohio. Trick, you seem intent on pushing an idea on a group of folks who don't buy it. What's the point? The cage has problems. You may not want to face it, but you're not going to get too many folks here to buy into it. Carry on.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuttingEdgeRacing Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 Tracks can approve all they want... What major tracks by the way?? Major Sanctioning bodies of REAL RACING will not allow this kind of engineering ignorance to continue. If you would like, I can show you at least 10 problems with the base model of this cage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tricknology Posted January 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 our cage is legal from michgan to florida,,here are the links to a few of the tracks rules. rules,, http://www.spartanspeedway.com/Info/rules2...lesContents.php http://www.autocityspeedway.com/divisions.php http://www.whittemorespeedway.net/?Display=Stock4Rules http://www.kalamazoospeedway.com/rules.asp http://www.berlinraceway.com/rules/b_rules.shtml http://www.columbusspeedway.com/asp/2007/Default.asp http://www.sanduskyspeedway.com/Rules/tabi...PageContentID=4 http://www.angolamotorspeedway.com/08rules/08MS1408.pdf http://www.newparisspeedway.com/rules_2007mini_stock.htm http://www.andersonspeedway.com/backgate/2...book_011808.pdf http://www.craracing.net/tech/2008/fwdrules2008.html http://charlottecountyracing.com/html/rules.shtml CC TEXAS http://theasphaltbullring.com/TT_Rules.html If your local track is not listed use the race track locator below,, http://www.chasinracin.com/track-locator/states/index.shtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 id like to know who has one down here in cc .i want to see who.s crazy enough to use that typ of cage .i dont have too look at it much .to decide i would not drive a car with that cage ...that cage design is scary and if noone has been hurt by it ..then they have not gotten in the correct wreck yet and i hope they dont ...aint really trying to down anyone other than it will get someone hurt .... ps trick .i have built a few over 27 years .and i did work on one fwd cage ... but anyway trick have a nice day .and keep us in the know .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuttingEdgeRacing Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 Ugh..... lets make this more simple. Show me a sanctioning body that allows this kind of cage. Not tracks, santioned bodies as I stated before. Regardless, this cage aint getting sold down here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratdaddy Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 Trick, As a track owner, tech man, safety official, concession stand worker, flagman, cleanup crew, welder,and hurt feeling mender for the past 15 years or so, I would not allow that cage to run with our Thunder cars. The decision would not be mine any more but I really don't think it would fly today. Good luck up north, and you might want to take our name off your list just to avoid any confusion. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiTech Posted January 28, 2008 Report Share Posted January 28, 2008 Trick, As a track owner, tech man, safety official, concession stand worker, flagman, cleanup crew, welder,and hurt feeling mender for the past 15 years or so, I would not allow that cage to run with our Thunder cars. The decision would not be mine any more but I really don't think it would fly today. Good luck up north, and you might want to take our name off your list just to avoid any confusion. Thanks. you forgot two ..car builder ..and driver ..who has been in some nasty nasty wrecks .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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